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Sizzla message 2015

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Messenger: ShivaJiva Sent: 2/4/2015 7:43:54 PM

And to compare homosexuality to pedophilia is very unfounded.

First, pedophilia is considered a mental disorder. The American Psychiatric Association (APA) has included pedophilia in its Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders since 1968. So that speaks for itself as well I think.

Secondly, Pedophilia is an expression of power and domination. It is the act of taking advantage over a child, expressing ones domination and essentially committing a violent act.

Homosexuality is a relationship between two consenting individuals. There is no comparison to pedophilia. Nobody is being taken advantage of. The same people who include pedophilia as a mental disorder, as you spoke to, do not believe homosexuality to be a mental disorder.

Messenger: RAS NATE Sent: 2/4/2015 8:44:32 PM

It is not unfounded.Because I was talking about removing moral standards and relying on the fact that there's no proof or that it doesn't seem to be wrong.
Both pedophilia and homosexuality are unnatural sexual preferences and therefore mental diseases.If pedophilia being in the DSM in this time speaks for itself,then homosexuality being in DSM all that time before 1973 should also speak for itself.
I wonder,if we were living in that time would you still consider it to be normal,or would the fact it's in DSM make it speak for itself?
So what I mean is imagine pedophilia would now stop to be considered a mental disorder because of lack of evidence it's a disorder..

It doesn't necessarily include violence towards children.Sometimes the children are fooled into abominations and are rewarded for example.Of course I am not saying pedophlia and homosexuality are the same,beacuse children who fall prey are not yet physically and psychosexually developed.But homosexuals are underdeveloped on some level,because they are lacking natural morality and discrimination between what is right and wrong,natural and unnatural.

You also mention many wrongful prejudiced condemnations based on racial discrimination or other wrongful grounds,but this doesn't mean that ALL the things that where condemned in the USA in that time where wrongfully condemned.That is a false analogy and doesn't lead anywhere.
For example if someone was a serial killer but at the same time condemned drinking alcohol.Shall we say then that drinking alcohol is surely good?

RasTa can't accept homosexuality and never will because it is immoral and unnatural.
It's a wombman and not a man who can conceive from a man for a reason.This is JAH divine creation.Adam and Eve not Adam and steve.

Messenger: Shasatabe Makonnen Sent: 2/4/2015 9:03:41 PM

You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. -Leviticus 18:22

If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them -Leviticus 20:13

Easiest way to kill off your seed and end your legacy

Like it or not..


Messenger: Black heart Sent: 2/4/2015 9:46:13 PM

Shivajiva. It seems like yo mission is to distroy de good reputation of Africa with yo false accusation. Why? U said in Africa there are cultures dat practise canibalism & human sacrifice, but when I ask u to mention those cultures u fail instead u mention areas where it is done. Why? Are u anti-Africa? Have u ever been here in Africa? De fact dat there are few individuals in a society who do wicked things like human sacrifice does not necessarily mean dat evil is a culture of de society.

Messenger: ShivaJiva Sent: 2/4/2015 10:06:58 PM

I don't want to highjack this thread as I have already made my opinion loud and clear.

But to respond to the most recent posts


To quote you: "Furthermore,if ones start to remove natural moral standards,and accept homosexuality beacuse there's no proof it's a mental illness or that it's wrong,ones might as well reach the conclusion that pedophilia isn't wrong as well,beacause there may not be proof it's a mental illness or that it's wrong."

There is proof that pedophilia is a mental illness. There is no proof that homophobia is, and thus it is no longer considered such. Why should a rational person, who does not believe that homosexuality is immoral, believe it is a mental illness if there is absolutely no such indication? My moral standards tell me it is wrong to condemn another individual for their sexual preference. Nothing in my conscious tells me it is wrong to be a homosexual. Again I ask, on what empirical grounds can you argue that homosexuality is immoral? Violence, or pedophilia we can say is immoral because it implies asserting a form of dominance over another individual. There are measurable consequences whether in bodily or psychological harm. Therefore, we can rationally and empirically conclude that pedophilia, acts of violence, extortion, etc...are all immoral. Aside from your own prejudices, on what grounds do you consider homosexuality to be immoral or unethical?

Yes, if I were living in a time when homosexuality was still considered a disorder I would stand by the rights of gay people. Much like today we live in a world with unjust laws and definitions, I don't orient my values in accordance with man-made laws. An obvious example are the current drug laws. There is a myriad of misinformation in regards to natural substances like cannabis, of which I partake every day.

To answer your question, many people are beginning to argue that pedophilia is not a disorder and I tend to agree with them. There is no evidence to support the claim that it is. In my opinion pedophilia is reprehensible because it is immoral, it has a measurable impact on the psychological health of its victims. Pedophiles might not have a mental disorder but their actions are immoral because they create measurable harm. Homosexuality doesn't harm anyone. It is neither a mental disorder, nor is it immoral. Therefore, I have to logically assume that to compare homosexuality with pedophilia has no precedence. The only similarity is in your mind; because you find pedophilia to be reprehensible and you find homosexuality distasteful, you subconsciously associate the two. In reality, there is no comparison. One is an act of control, the other is an act of love.

I don't quite understand your analogy with the serial killer and alcohol. But your argument is that simply because Babylon typically unjustly condemns people, it is not always unjust? I'd like to point out this argument could be conveniently used to justify any kind of crusade against any group of people, and seems counter-intuitive me. We are rational individuals. We can look to the past and we can see where we have done right and where we have done wrong, and I can think of virtually no historical precedent in which a group of peoples was justly condemned for an "ethical" reason. Let me also point out that your very argument could be used in the opposite way. Many here have pointed out that just because some African cultures accepted homosexuality doesn't mean the majority did, but if we are to blindly accept the customs of our past than why exclude those many African cultures which promoted homosexual relationships?

Again I ask you, on what grounds do you claim it to be immoral or unnatural?

Adam and Eve were also naked and it wasn't until they sinned that they felt compelled to cover themselves. Perhaps our clothes make us all wicked sinners?


@Shasatabe Makonnen

Half of the Bible can be quoted to promote murder, rape, slavery, and bigotry of all types. My first post in this thread was entirely Bible excerpts. I would not cite the Bible as an ethical reference if my life depended on it.

Leviticus ALSO says:

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

Homosexuals are in no way a threat to the seed of mankind. Overpopulation is a huge problem. If anything we need more people refusing to have kids and adopting, not less.


@Black heart

My mission isn't to destroy the reputation of Africa, it is to point out that we must acknowledge that to hold up outdated and unjust traditions simply because they are "traditions" is ludicrous. Our homeland is not perfect, our ancestors did some terrible things to one another and in some place they continue to.

I was talking about cultures which did practice cannibalism in the past because we the argument was that homosexuality is unAfrican because that's always been African tradition. My point was that cannibalism and human sacrifice was also an African tradition, and I did provide several examples. I'll re-iterate:

"Human sacrifice was common in West African states up to and during the 19th century. The Annual customs of Dahomey was the most notorious example, but sacrifices were carried out all along the West African coast and further inland. Sacrifices were particularly common after the death of a King or Queen, and there are many recorded cases of hundreds or even thousands of slaves being sacrificed at such events. Sacrifices were particularly common in Dahomey, in the Benin Empire, in what is now Ghana, and in the small independent states in what is now southern Nigeria.

In the Asante region of modern day Ghana, human sacrifice was often combined with capital punishment.

In the northern parts of West Africa, human sacrifice had become rare early as Islam became more established in these areas such as the Hausa States. Human sacrifice was officially banned in the remainder of West African states only by coercion, or in some cases annexation, by either the British or French. An important step was the British coercing the powerful Egbo secret society to oppose human sacrifice in 1850. This society was powerful in a large number of states in what is now south-eastern Nigeria. Nonetheless, human sacrifice continued, normally in secret, until West Africa came under firm colonial control.

The Leopard men were a West African secret society active into mid-1900s that practised cannibalism. In theory, the ritual cannibalism would strengthen both members of the society as well as their entire tribe. In Tanganyika, the Lion men committed an estimated 200 murders in a single three-month period"

In regions of the Congo and Uganda groups still sacrifice humans, often infants. (source: But my point wasn't about the fact that some areas still carry out this practice in the name of tradition, it was about the fact that these practices used to be widespread throughout Africa. It wasn't just pockets of a few "bad" individuals. Human sacrifice is a part of African culture. Like it or not, it's just as much a part of us as the Pyramids of Egypt.

I mean no disrespect to Mother Africa. I just wish to acknowledge that even she is flawed, and we must learn from our flaws and imperfections. We often speak of reparations for what Babylon did to the African people, and we are often frustrated that Babylon so frequently happens to forget or downplay the impact of their actions and the brutality of former cultural traditions such as slavery. Yet at the same time they lift up their leaders and white-wash their history and foreign policy, as if they have learned over time and all of European history is noble and there is no need to change their ways now. words may be unpopular but I call things how I see them.

Defend it all you want, however you want...hate is hate is hate, doesn't matter how you cut it. I love all of you, as brothers and sisters, and I send you all my utmost respect...but I sincerely hope that one day you might see the wickedness that often arises in our own hearts even when we fail to see it, and I hope that you might see that all people are deserving of compassion and respect even if we might find each-others ways distasteful. Surely none of us deserves to be deprived of our rights or deserves to be a target of violence where we have not instigated it ourselves.

"We must become bigger than we have been: more courageous, greater in spirit, larger in outlook. We must become members of a new race, overcoming petty prejudice, owing our ultimate allegiance not to nations but to our fellow men within the human community."

"History teaches us that unity is strength, and cautions us to submerge and overcome our differences in the quest for common goals, to strive, with all our combined strength, for the path to true African brotherhood and unity."

--The words of Haile Selassie, so says HIM

Bless Up for the gift of reason, Love and Unity for all of Iration

Messenger: Eleazar Sent: 2/4/2015 10:26:53 PM

Shiva Jiva,

This is a forum for RasTafarI people. I am warning you, do not continue to post arguments advocating homosexuality on this forum as it is very offensive to I and I RasTafarI people.

The whole world may go astray but I and I will never bow down to wickedness.

Messenger: Black heart Sent: 2/4/2015 10:48:45 PM

Shivajiva. which African cultures promote homosexuality? what is wrong with u realy? why are tarnishing de image of Africa? U seem to have de mentality dat Africa is a land of savages? U also seem to think civilisation came with de whites ina Africa? It is clear to I dat u don't know about Africa, so u better seek info about Africa from we Africans ina Africa, instead of relyin on white propaganda leterature dat was ment to humilliate & dehumanise Africa. Fireburn yo white heart. Burn anti-Africa

Messenger: Shasatabe Makonnen Sent: 2/4/2015 10:55:17 PM

Now the I comes with depopulation talk. Fyah pon dem fuckry & babylon pagan works!

Messenger: ShivaJiva Sent: 2/4/2015 10:56:09 PM


If reasoning is unwelcome here, then I will stop reasoning.

Do not worry, I won't post anything else in this thread.


Sorry for offending...I meant no harm in defending the "wicked ways" of our brothers and sisters. If it means anything to you, I do not believe exclusion or censorship is the road a unified and liberated African people.

Please just read my words...Im not saying Africa is full of savages at all, Im just saying that Africa has imperfections and if we ignore them we are subject to repeat mistakes and injustices of the past. I love my people and I love my homeland but I will not idolize her and allow her to fall into a rut of destructive tendencies because our community refuses to acknowledge them.

Jah Bless

Messenger: Ark I Sent: 2/4/2015 11:13:18 PM

I have reasoned in the past and recently about what I and I Life is and the importance of I and I Life. If a person chooses to not continue their life by not having children whether heterosexual our homosexual, it is a disrespect to the Creator and their ancestors, who have fought to survive from since the beginning of I and I existence, to live and have children so the life they were given could continue. The only reason any of us exist is that every single foreparent fought to survive and had children. Life is everything and I and I Life has Itinued for so long, RasTafarI is Life and will never be death.

Here are some other Reasonings

I see my life as the same as my father's and mother's life. I don't see my life as beginning when this flesh came out of I mother. I see I life as beginning when Jah created Life.

And I see that all of my ancestors since the beginning of time, have Itinued their life by fighting to survive and having children to Itinue their line.

So to I it is a shame when I hear people choosing not to have children, because of their lifestyle or any other reason. It is a great disrespect to all their foreparents who have Itinued this life for so very long. The only reason that we exist is because all of our foreparents Itinued Life.

Just think of how many centuries have past since I and I life began. So many centuries of struggling to Itinue this life. Then one selfish generation comes and only sees their life as born and dead, and give up what their foreparents fought so hard to keep.

If Jah strikes a man or woman so that they cannot have children, then this is Jah's doing. But if a man or woman chooses this, it is a great sin, and Jah will not turn his eyes away from this.


I don't believe that a man or woman is born gay, I believe it is a choice. I believe that some men are born more masculine and others more feminine, and that some women are born more feminine and others more masculine. But that doesn't mean that they are supposed to be gay, they are just supposed to be the way they are structured along the range of masculine and feminine. And join with another to Itinue their Life. It is the confusion that says that a feminine man or a masculine woman must be gay that convinces people of this, and so they follow what they have been taught.

If people are born gay as many people say, then that means that it is time for that person's line to end, the life of their foreparents was not meant to continue.

But I still see it as a choice that people make. A man is to Love their friend as a Brother, not a wife.

RasTafarI is a movement of Life, not death

batty bwoys


Many people talk about genes that show a person is gay.

If they truly found genes that were linked to batty boys, what it is really linked to is men who are more feminine than other men. Just because a man is feminine doesn't mean they are gay. But when these feminine men grow other people tell them that they are gay and they believe that foolishness. Or others are not told directly but are treated differently and nobody came and told them that it was ok to be a feminine man and it doesn't mean that they are gay.

I just saw an episode of Dr. Phil the other day. He had men on the show who were heterosexual and married, but had many feminine ways and a feminine physical and facial structure. Dr. Phil criticized these men for their feminine ways, but I know that if some batty boys came on Dr. Phil's show, he would never criticize their feminine ways. This is part of the conditioning that guides these people into destruction.

When I was in high school, if a man was more feminine but not gay, people would say that it was just a matter of time and they would eventually fall out. And then there are men who are old and gray and are feminine but are not gay. If only more would see the truth and realize that being feminine may be part of their structure, but being gay is not.

Many people may not believe me, but one day when your scientists learn more about Creation, they will tell people the same thing.

batty bwoys

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