Use the drop-down boxes above to navigate through the Website  
Return to Reasoning List
 

Here is a link to this page:
http://www.jah-rastafari.com/forum/message-view.asp?message_group=5378&start_row=21


Inter racial breeding

1 - 1011 - 2021 - 3031 - 4041 - 5051 - 6061 - 7071 - 8081 - 9091 - 100
101 - 110111 - 120121 - 130131 - 140141 - 150151 - 154
Time Zone: EST (New York, Toronto)
Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/27/2013 9:52:43 PM
Reply

^Since you brought it up. You do realise that Haile Selassie NEVER said what you just wrote? I don't know which guy edited that, maybe Marley knows, but the speech from HIM of Until, states reference to his African identity and adressing the African race several times. I only say that because for some reason this version of His Majesty's speech misses Africa out completely as if it held no relevance. The Context in which something is said is not something to be edited out.

This speech shows example of Haile Selassie WARNING the foreign invaders / apartheid masters of the time that there WILL be war + in a time when black people are second class citizens to europeans in africa then there should be war, if necessary...

Corrected:

That until the philosophy which holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned; That until there are no longer first-class and second-class citizens of any nation; That until the color of a man's skin is of no more significance than the color of his eyes; That until the basic human rights are equally guaranteed to all without regard to race; That until that day, the dream of lasting peace and world citizenship and the rule of international morality will remain but a fleeting illusion, to be pursued but never attained; And until the ignoble and unhappy regimes that hold OUR BROTHERS in Angola, in Mozambique and in South Africa in subhuman bondage have been toppled and destroyed; Until bigotry and prejudice and malicious and inhuman self-interest have been replaced by understanding and tolerance and good-will; Until all AFRICANS stand and speak as free beings, equal in the eyes of all men, as they are in the eyes of Heaven; Until that day, the AFRICAN continent will not know peace. WE AFRICANS WILL FIGHT, if necessary, and WE know that WE shall win, as WE are confident in the victory of good over evil. – Haile Selassie I


Just because somebody chooses to respect their bloodline does not mean that person sees his bloodline as superior or inferior. That arguent cant work rasta


Messenger: SunofMan Sent: 11/27/2013 10:28:26 PM
Reply

King, "ethnic" is the word you chose, when you said:

"in ETHIOPIA, it is forbidden for any woman to have intimate relations with somebody from a different ethnic group."

If you meant race, you should have just said race. The term ethnic has a different implication; it is synonymous with what you imply is tribalism.

There are always youths and elders which due to their cultural, tribal, ethnic, or racial affiliations feel they shouldn't mix with, at the very least, another race. That's fine, it's their prerogative, but that doesn't change the fact that there is no truth to the statement you made. It's not forbidden, and some elders care and some don't, you'll obviously clique with the Ones that share your opinion.

However, "you think they would amalgamate with the arab the mongoloid or the caucasian?"....absolutely if the fell in love with One or even just in lust with One, history has already proved that point. People are capable of everything someone wishes they weren't...Garvey included.

I don't mean to depreciate your values...the preservation of "ethnic" identity is a blessing in that it provides this world with some sense of culture, pride, and identity. I really just meant to challenge your concept of what is forbidden in Ethiopia.

Selam


Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/28/2013 6:08:35 AM
Reply

I already stated Ethiopians are an indigenous mix of Africa. My mind doesn't even THINK of black people as different tribes and ethnicities. That's a colonial way of thinking. Ethnic can mean race under any definition whether noun or adjective but I still wouldn't usually use that word and certain not to divide black people.....

anyone who has an over standing of Marcus Garvey words regarding race and ethnicity will see exactly what I mean

And of course it is traditionally unacceptable. Stop looking locally. Over stand the mind of people like Menelik when it came onto mixing with foreigners..... Never mind racially them people a burn it out sociopolitically and technologically. Did not trust none Africans at all. So that's my reference. How much Caucasian or Arab blood is the in the historical Ethiopian? Come off that bullshit. Any mixing of the Ethiopian bloodline is within the past 50 years. You can't argue with Ethiopian history and geneology

When I look at history I look holistically not just 'how things are now'

Some countries have promoted this mixing, some haven't made an effort for or against it, ethiopia, historically, has not been a country for inter racial breeding, the title of the topic. Thanks


Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/28/2013 6:32:47 AM
Reply

Look up the meaning of the word Ethnic. The word can be used to differentiate different tribes. But it can also be used to differentiate africans from none africans. Infact it can be used to differentiate almost ANY group from another group. So as a conscious pan-african why would i WANT to differentiate / divide black people? Why would i do that? When RASTA refer to Ethiopia more time he is referring for his general love of what is innately AFRICAN, and not putting th Omoro above the Amhara or vice versa.... sounds too much like slave master. Thats why i bun the word because people like yourself get it confused. We can reason about tribalism another time. This is dealing with inter-racial business.

The Life And Times Of Menelik Ii: Ethiopia 1844 1913
by Harold G. Marcus
- since you asked for a specific reference.

As for Genetic studies, since we are going there... Back this with the Teachings of Menelik (which i suggest you revise) and leaders of past and I think thats my point. And i'd tell any modern aged lost Ethiopian about themself.

Autosomal DNA
Tishkoff et al. (2009) identified fourteen ancestral population clusters which correlate with self-described ethnicity and shared cultural and/or linguistic properties in Africa in what was the largest autosomal study of the continent to date.[9] The Burji, Konso and Beta Israel were sampled from Ethiopia. The Afroasiatic speaking Ethiopians sampled were cumulatively (Fig.5B) found to belong to: 71% in the "Cushitic" cluster, 6% in the "Saharan/Dogon" cluster, 5% in the "Niger Kordofanian" cluster, 3% each in the "Nilo-Saharan" and "Chadic Saharan" cluster, while the balance (12%) of their assignment was distributed among the remnant (9) Associated Ancestral Clusters (AAC's) found in Sub-Saharan Africa.[10] The "Cushitic" cluster was also deemed "closest to the non-African AACs, consistent with an East African migration of modern humans out of Africa or a back-migration of non-Africans into Saharan and Eastern Africa."[11]
Wilson et al. (2001), an autosomal DNA study based on cluster analysis that looked at a combined sample of Amhara and Oromo examining a single enzyme variants: drug metabolizing enzyme (DME) loci, found that 62% of Ethiopeans fall into the same cluster of Ashkenazi Jews, Norwegians and Armenians based on that gene. Only 24% of Ethiopians cluster with Bantus and Afro-Caribbeans, 8% with Papua New Guineans, and 6% with Chinese.[12]
Paternal Lineages
Y DNA Haplogroups of Ethiopia alt text

Y DNA Haplogroups of Ethiopia
A composite look at most YDNA studies done so far reveals that,out of a total of 459 males sampled from Ethiopia, approximately 58% of Y-chromosome haplotypes were found to belong to Haplogroup E, of which 71% (41% of total) were characterized by one of its further downstream sub lineage known as E1b1b, while the remainder were mostly characterized by Haplogroup E1b1(x E1b1b,E1b1a), and to a lesser extent Haplogroup E2. With respect to E1b1b, some studies have found that it exists at its highest level among the Oromo, where it represented 62.8% of the haplotypes, while it was found at 35.4% among the Amhara,[15] other studies however have found an almost equal representation of Haplogroup E1b1b at approximately 57% in both the Oromo and the Amhara.[18] The haplogroup (as its predecessor E1b1) is thought to have originated in Ethiopia or elsewhere in the Horn of Africa. About one half of E1b1b found in Ethiopia is further characterized by E1b1b1a (M78), which arose later in north-eastern Africa and then back-migrated to eastern Africa.[19]
Haplogroup J has been found at a frequency of approximately 18% in Ethiopians, with a higher prevalence among the Amhara, where it has been found to exist at levels as high as 35%, of which about 94% (17% of total) is of the type J1, while 6% (1% of total) is of J2 type.[20] On the other hand, 26% of the individuals sampled in the Arsi control portion of Moran et al. (2004) were found to belong to Haplogroup J.[16]
Another fairly prevalent lineage in Ethiopia belongs to Haplogroup A, occurring at a frequency of about 17% within Ethiopia, it is almost all characterized by its downstream sub lineage of A3b2 (M13). Restricted to Africa, and mostly found along the Rift Valley from Ethiopia to Cape Town, Haplogroup A represents the deepest branch in the Human Y- Chromosome phylogeny.[21]
Finally, Haplogroup T at approximately 4% and Haplogroup B at approximately 3%, make up the remainder of the Y-DNA Haplogroups found within Ethiopia.
Maternal Lineages
mtDNA Haplogroups of Ethiopia alt text

mtDNA Haplogroups of Ethiopia[22]
The maternal ancestry of Ethiopians is similarly diverse. About half (52.2%) of Ethiopians belongs to mtdna Haplogroups L0, L1, L2, L3, L4, L5, or L6. These haplogroups are generally confined to the African continent. They also originated either in Ethiopia or very near. The other portion of the population belong to Haplogroup N (31%) and Haplogroup M1 (17%).[22] There is controversy surrounding their origins as either native or a possible ancient back migration into Ethiopia from Asia. (- that last sentence is a racist joke)

_____________________________________________________

Please overstand the point you are arguing. That Ethiopia, historically, has been all for inter-racial mixing between themselves and none Africans...

- are you really making that point Rasta?

The thread was to get other people views, what is your view on the topic? Not whether you agree with my points


Messenger: SunofMan Sent: 11/28/2013 4:56:00 PM
Reply

"Please overstand the point you are arguing. That Ethiopia, historically, has been all for inter-racial mixing between themselves and none Africans..."

Seriously?!...I never said anything like that. For centuries racial mixing has been non existent in Ethiopia because it is such a relatively isolated nation. "All for inter racial mixing"? I never implied that at all. The only thing that I've implied is that Ethiopia has never, as a nation, had some kind of forbidden rule that you stated existed:

"in ETHIOPIA, it is forbidden for any woman to have intimate relations with somebody from a different ethnic group."

My point is that statement is historically and currently untrue, and that such statements when made with conviction on the internet lead to false interpretation by many, a dangerous practice.

My opinion on the subject is that when it comes to intimate relations Ethiopians are under no bondage. I agree emphatically that the unique identity of the Ethiopian peoples is a beauty to behold and it would be a great loss to see that disappear.

Selam


Messenger: Raybob Sent: 11/28/2013 7:52:51 PM
Reply

<<<"Just because somebody chooses to respect their bloodline does not mean that person sees his bloodline as superior or inferior. That arguent cant work rasta">>>

Now that's funny. How would someone marrying someone from a different race have any effect on their bloodline? Everyone always has the same bloodline, no matter who they marry. Their descendants will have that same bloodline as well, regardless of the 'race' one marries.

InI am Kohanim, my Grandmother's maiden name was Cohen. That makes me decendant of Aaron, and of Levi. InI are white and bun in the sun. There are Kohanim that are black too. Did you know only Kohanim are permitted to view or move the Ark of the Covenant in Ethiopia?

The idea of inter-marrying within one's own lineage is what the elite that rule the world are all about. Preserving their 'bloodline'. People that do that suffer from one of the six things Jah HATES, called "pride".

Six things are hated by the Lord; seven things are disgusting to him: Eyes of PRIDE, a false tongue, hands which take life without cause; A heart full of evil designs, feet which are quick in running after sin; A false witness, breathing out untrue words, and one who lets loose violent acts among brothers. -(Pro 6:16-19)



Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/28/2013 8:34:35 PM
Reply

Sun of man i see you.

Raybob, i asked for your opinion, why did you feel the need to quote me directly and end your post with scripture about false tongue and heart of evil. So now i'm compelled to respond to your comment, with my opinion, which was never my intention. Understand you quoted me.

Raybob:
Now that's funny. How would someone marrying someone from a different race have any effect on their bloodline? Everyone always has the same bloodline, no matter who they marry. Their descendants will have that same bloodline as well, regardless of the 'race' one marries.

The idea of inter-marrying within one's own lineage is what the elite that rule the world are all about. Preserving their 'bloodline'. People that do that suffer from one of the six things Jah HATES, called "pride"

_____________________________________________________________________________________
_____________________________________________________________________________________


mis·ce·ge·na·tion noun (ˌ;;;)mi-ˌ;;;se-jə;;;-ˈ;;;nā;;;-shə;;;n, ˌ;;;mi-si-jə;;;-ˈ;;;nā;;;-
: sexual relations or marriage between people of two different races (such as a white person and a black person)

Full Definition of MISCEGENATION

: a mixture of races; especially : marriage, cohabitation, or sexual intercourse between a white person and a member of another race
— mis·ce·ge·na·tion·al adjective

"THE UNIVERSAL NEGRO IMPROVEMENT ASSOCIATION ADVOCATES THE UNITING AND BLENDING OF ALL NEGROES INTO ONE STRONG, HEALTHY RACE. IT IS AGAINST MISCEGENATION AND RACE SUICIDE"
MARCUS GARVEY, PRESIDENT-GENERAL OF THE U.N.I.A.


Messenger: Raybob Sent: 11/29/2013 5:55:31 AM
Reply

"Until the color of a man's skin is no more significant than the color of his eyes, there will NOT be peace of Jah Ras Tafari in the heart of the person that thinks a color of skin IS significant." -Rasta Raybob


Messenger: Jah Dub Sent: 11/29/2013 12:13:07 PM
Reply

It's none of InI's business to have an opinion about the race -mixed or not - of someone's else's offspring


Messenger: Sister Sent: 11/29/2013 3:38:01 PM
Reply

Does cultural purity matter as much as genetic ‘purity’? Would it be acceptable for said Ethiopian couple to move to Babylon as long as they didn’t interbreed? Would it acceptable for an Ethiopian Empress to wear her hair straight and blonde and work for Barclays Bank, as long as her daughter didn’t fall for a European? What if she lived in Babylon so long she didn’t accept her ‘own’ historic culture?

If one was moved by force or by reason of survival from place of racial origin and forced to experience life through the culture of another people, and that place of racial origin no longer existed, would it be wrong to find a sense of belonging in one who loved you with a purity above and beyond the flesh?

Rasta held onto their culture no matter how hard and how long and how far from home, no matter how mixed the gene pool. Retaining the heritage and culture of a nation through its people is important, but what’s in the spirit of a person is more important than the percentage of pure DNA they have.

Peace.



1 - 1011 - 2021 - 3031 - 4041 - 5051 - 6061 - 7071 - 8081 - 9091 - 100
101 - 110111 - 120121 - 130131 - 140141 - 150151 - 154

Return to Reasoning List




RastafarI
 
Haile Selassie I