Use the drop-down boxes above to navigate through the Website  
Return to Reasoning List
 

Here is a link to this page:
http://www.jah-rastafari.com/forum/message-view.asp?message_group=1301&start_row=11


Apostle Paul-Early Baldhead

1 - 1011 - 2021 - 23
Time Zone: EST (New York, Toronto)
Messenger: Dread Lion Sent: 2/1/2006 12:03:25 PM
Reply

MAY THE WORDS OF I MOUTH AND THE IDITATIONS OF I HEART BE ACCEPTABLE UNTO JAH

It can be argued that:
Pauline Christianity saved the faith from passing away into the obscurity of history like all of the other concurrent Jewish and proto-Christian sects of the time
AND/OR
that it co-opted and polluted a purely Jewish movement and was therefore responsible for all of the subsequent follies of the church.

Paul was a Gentile, the first non-Jewish Christian leader. It was Paul’s version of Christianity that Rome found most palatable. In time Paul’s version of Christianity became “orthodox” (“right thinking”) and became the State religion. Then all other versions of Christianity were ruthlessly extinguished. Only with relatively recent archeological discoveries have they been at least partially re-discovered. The early Christian community was like Rastafari is in this time; like Bobo, Nyahbinghi, Twleve Tribes etc.,there were Ebionites, Marcionites, Gnostics etc.

an open question:
Is it a good thing that Christianity was codified by religio-political proccesses into one orthodox creed which was enforced by authority?



A reasoning:
The Bible is not ‘a’ book it is an anthology of books from many different times and places. Clearly the Idea of God evolved from a limited tribal diety (showing anger, jealousy, indecision and even ignorance and making mistakes!) into a universal diety of love, compassion and forgiveness. This evolution will continue as human understanding continues to move towards Truth until the need for books and doctrines melts away in the Reality of Livity in Love, Compassion and Overstanding. Eventually people will outgrow the urge to limit God to pre-conceived ideas and embrace the Vast Mystery of which we are a part.

LOVE AND ONLY LOVE




Messenger: Nyah Jahphet Anbassa I Sent: 2/1/2006 2:19:23 PM
Reply

Blessed

Hmm yes Paul.... he is still strange to me. I was not able to take that man for full.... all his strange things he taught were 100% anti Yeshuah and pro catholic to me. But nevertheless it was King Selassie I HIMself who quoted him often and said him was an good exemple.
So in my early days I went to the sources to find some enlightenment. I steped the same ground as Paul did, entered the same ancient cities through the same entries, stood at the same market places, visited the ancient places. I was there in what the bible calls "province asia", parts of today greece. I was there to find some answers to questions that were a heavy load pon my mind and soul.
But I must disapoint you, I did not find them. Back home again I realized, it is good to study and see things for oneself, but the only one who can bring answers is JAH. Long time I was strictly anti-paul. But I realized that Paul was not a bad man, he was just a man, like me and you and I n I. He was nothing special, not higher than anybody else. He had his own conclusions and opinions, and so have I myself my own. I'm shure he was not bad minded, otherwise HIM wouldn't have quoted him. And he has some good points, and some may just got strange over the years and translations. For exemple I can not imagine that paul said you mustnt ware long hair..... didn't you read in the acts that he was a Nazarite for some time?

So now I studied Paul for some years.... and came to the conclusion.... use your own mind and do not put Paul higher than he was.... those of his words which seem wise to you will get you forward.... the others will give you also a good reasoning. Just because Paul said it it is not Law. So don't get vex bout it. Everyone has the right to disagree, so also paul.

Selah


Messenger: White dread Sent: 2/1/2006 2:29:24 PM
Reply

Blessed Love pon your reply Nyah Jahphet Anbassa I


Messenger: Tefer_Anbesa Sent: 2/1/2006 8:11:58 PM
Reply

He is one of the originators of the Apostolic order of which the Ethiopian Tewahdo Hymanot is foremost.

besemay yemitnor abatachin hoy !




Messenger: Dread Lion Sent: 6/6/2006 2:45:46 PM
Reply

This post got I interested in Paul, so Iman did some research and am reporting back what I have discovered.

First of all Paul was an observant Jew. He was the first Christian to spread the gospel to non-Jews, up until then Jesus had been a strictly Jewish concern. He never met Jesus in person, but rather had a vision which he claimed gave him authority on par with Jesus actual disciples.

There survives a considerable body of literature which claims to be written by Paul, both inside and outside of the Bible. Less than half of this material is widely accepted by scholars to have actually been written by Paul (which is remarkable in itself, we have NO writings from Jesus or Peter), then there are a few works which scholars still debate the authorship of and then there are the rest which are undisputed forgeries (because they address people who weren't born until after Paul was dead, etc).

When InI study just the works which are most probably penned by Paul a different picture of Paul is painted than in the book of Acts which was written by the author of Luke some time after Paul was dead and gone. In fact here is a short list of differences I see between what Paul (P) says himself and what “Luke” (L) says about Paul in Acts:

P: claims pagans are culpable for the sin of ignoring the one true God
L: Paul says God forgives the ignorance of pagans

P: claims NOT to have met with the original Jerusalem apostles after his conversion
L: portrays Paul as meeting with and agreeing in all ways with the Jerusalem apostles

P: claims to have lived as a Gentile when in their lands
L: shows Paul as faithfully observant of Jewish law

P: refused to have the Gentile Titus circumcised to appease Jewish-Christians
L: Paul has Timothy circumcised to appease Jewish-Christians

P: speaks frankly about his disagreements with Peter and other apostles
L: portrays Paul as always in total agreement with the Jerusalem apostles

Paul clearly accepted the role of women in the church while the later writers of 1 and 2 Timothy and Titus (a.k.a. the Pastoral Epistles) have Paul forbidding women from even speaking aloud in church.

To see how it happens that historical figures get re-invented according to the concerns of the present one need look no further than Rastafari. When ones post things here about Bongo Watto, Ras Pidow, Sis Bubbles, Emmanuel Edwards etc., they are not dispassionate, objective chroniclers of accurate historical facts, they are representing their own beliefs by emphasizing certain things while ignoring or minimizing other things. Now consider this process taking place over thousands of years where almost everyone is illiterate, the few texts that exist are copied by hand and there is no method of research or verification available.


Taken purely on his own terms, Paul's main concern seems to be the imminent return of Jesus and the coming of the Kingdom of God, which he clearly believed in as a literal physical event which was about to happen in his natural lifetime. I see no sign of any long term planning on Paul's part, no advice for future generations that he never expected would exist.



Messenger: Ark I Sent: 6/7/2006 12:02:57 AM
Reply

Dread Lion,

The way I trod is that I listen to what anybody says, no matter who they are and judge for Iself if what they say is right to I or not.

I agree with some things that Paul says and I disagree with other things. And usually when I read his words I compare them to what I learned from Eashua Christ.


Ark I
RasTafarI
Haile Selassie I


Messenger: Dread Lion Sent: 6/7/2006 1:01:34 AM
Reply

Yes I Ark I,

Wisemind!

Iman notice that Paul says nothing significant about Jesus' life or teachings, but rather he focuses strictly on his death and resurrection. All that bloody cross business did not come from Jesus' teachings. Paul is a tough nut to crack, it is hard to agree with everything he said, (and everything other people said he said) and yet he is the first and most powerful force in the formation of Christianity outside of Jesus and his companions.

ONE LOVE


Messenger: Nyah Jahphet Anbassa I Sent: 6/7/2006 11:29:37 AM
Reply

Blessed

There was a time when I used all my time to fight Pauline teachings. I even went to the original places in Province Asia (now turkey/greece) to study the greatest fraud who ever lived, as I thought him to be. But after some years now I cooled down pon the topic.

Paul was a man with his own revelation. I do not see no need to put him over the original apostles, but also not to curse him. By the way, I also feel that some of his statements (for example about slavery) just got confused through the translations and interpretations.
Like Peter wisely said about Paul's letters:
"As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction." 2 Peter 3:16

I do not agree with everything that the early christians personally said or believed, I do not agree with everything that EOC Patriarchs believe, I do not agree with everything that some Rasta Elders believe, or some Rasta Brethren. And I put Paul just in this line. Everybody is entitled to his own opinion, I respect that, but that does not mean that I have to share everything.

All those statements of Paul that HIM picked are wise to my overstanding.

Blessed Love
Selah


Messenger: I Selahssie i son Sent: 6/7/2006 11:58:31 AM
Reply

Now u might disagree with me,but I read and study the books Ras Paul and it look like he was on our side.The way the Europeans translated about him would make u feel like he was one of them.It was written that he was a slave bond in chains too like us,he went through sorten tribulation with Corinthians,the Ephesians,etc.He was born in bobylon but he was against them,he even met some the disiples and they had the same faith in the lord.Remember they lock him up for talking the truth too u know when he was in Rome,remember he wrath the Romans u know,it was written.He show dem the difference between their lawless law and the almighty god law.The Europeans think he was one of them but his written words still bringing them down to the dust.Ras Paul man,Paul could not be a bald head and he chant down bobylon so. Dont forget wa Selahssie i Say about the acient apostles u konw.


Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 6/7/2006 9:39:20 PM
Reply

It is saddening to see the I post and talk about US and THEM and also post of "he was a slave bond in chains too like us" where you bound in chains are you a slave? IF you mean Babylon trying to enslave us for their goals then I agree. Otherwise that is like saying i am a nazi just because i am german. im a godloving person struggling to get babylon of my back and live by HIM words.

Let us not use language of division otherwise we will keep making steps backward for every step forward.

One Love and much respect

Bergy


1 - 1011 - 2021 - 23

Return to Reasoning List




RastafarI
 
Haile Selassie I