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Free Will vs. Destiny

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Messenger: Ark I Sent: 1/13/2004 3:31:13 PM

Greetings, I agree that Jah is One, and only has One will, and Jah never changes. But I can't say the same about man. Because they sometimes choose this illusion, even though it is not real and is not created by Jah, some men still follow it. The I said, ------------------------- If a man follow illusion then he is not following Jah. ------------------------- Then is this man doing the will of Jah, or not? And the I said, ------------------------- A man who follow illusion does not realize that his choices are the will of God, because he does not see the will of God, but he "sees" illusion. ------------------------- So when the man chooses to follow the illusion, who's choice was it that cause him to follow illusion? His choice, or Jah choice? Blessed Love, Ark I RasTafarI Haile Selassie I

Messenger: mdjonas Sent: 1/13/2004 4:00:42 PM

A man who follow illusion does not know what he is doing. He is not conscious of it. His actions are the will of Jah, but he cannot be said to be doing Jah will, because he is not conscious. A man in his fullness is conscious of himself, and knows what he is doing and why. A conscious man chooses freely, and what he chooses is Jah will. A conscious man knows what he is doing, so he is doing what he wills, and what Jah wills. That is Oneness of man and Jah. A man who is not conscious is not even doing his own will. Nobody wants to follow illusion. The only way to do what we really want to do is to serve Jah. A man who follow illusion is denying himself when he denies Jah. Jah guides us to follow our own hearts. Don't imagine that wicked people are following their hearts. They are following illusion. A man who follows illusion is not making a free choice to do so, but he is a slave to corruption and ignorance. It is Jah choice to make that man a slave, so he is doing Jah will. But he is not aware of what is going on, so he cannot said to be making a choice in that matter. We must see that a man is a conscious being. A man who walks into a wall did not choose to do it. But he made a mistake. It was Jah who caused him to make the mistake and it was Jah will that he made the mistake. But he was not following Jah when he walked into the wall, because Jah would not guide someone to do that. We have a choice to follow Jah guidance, but we must follow his will. Sometimes it is Jah will that people would not follow his guidance. The promise of Zion is that we would know Jah will and follow it, and that way we attain oneness with him on the level of consciousness. We are always one with him in the sense that our actions are his will, but mistakes and accidents cannot be said to be our actions. I man am seeking to overcome all ignorance of Jah, so that I will realize that I am one with him. Look into the future of realize - Bob Marley.

Messenger: Ark I Sent: 1/13/2004 4:49:14 PM

Greetings, That is how the I see it Jonas, but I don't see it the same way. I still see that I and I have a choice, and it is we that make the choice. Just because someone makes a bad choice, doesn't mean that they didn't do it on purpose. They maybe didn't fully understand the consequences of their choice, and they maybe had no desire for these consequences. But they made the choice and received the consequences. The I said, ----------------- A man who walks into a wall did not choose to do it. ----------------- He maybe didn't choose to walk into the wall, but he made choices that lead to him walking into the wall. Just like a man that drinks and drives, doesn't choose to get into an accident. His intention was to drive home. But his choice of drinking and driving was his choice, and he is well aware of the risks of doing so. He may think that he can overcome those risks, but he still made the choice to drink and drive, and the consequence followed. James 1 12 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. 13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. Ezekiel 18 20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. 21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. 23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? 24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die. 25 Yet ye say, The way of the LORD is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal? 26 When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die. 27 Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive. 28 Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 29 Yet saith the house of Israel, The way of the LORD is not equal. O house of Israel, are not my ways equal? are not your ways unequal? 30 Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin. 31 Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? 32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye. Based on these two scriptures alone, I don't see that it is Jah will in the bad choices people make. And I also see Jah telling us to consider, and make a choice, and turn ourselves. And there are many other scriptures that show that Jah doesn't want people to fall into sin. And if I and I just look into our own lives, we make choices. At least that is what I see. Sometimes I make a bad choice, and when I check what happened, and Iverstand how I made that choice, the next time a similar situation come, I don't make the same choice, but I make a different one. I think about it, and I consciously make a different choice the next time around. And some times we make a bad choice, and before we make the choice, we know what will probably happen, and we can see the consequences, but we still make the choice. Just because I walk around a corner and run into a hot furnace that I didn't see, doesn't mean that I am faultless, and didn't choose a path that lead to that consequence. I should have been more aware, and knew that when I can't see around a corner, anything can be around that corner. So I should have first looked around that corner, and made sure that I way was clear. Jah Live, Ark I RasTafarI Haile Selassie I

Messenger: ijah Sent: 1/13/2004 6:38:42 PM

Greetings brthren an sistren InI would say that JAH nver has any bad intentions towards man..NEVA THAT..Him always is there for us,and Him always wants man to see in happiness and righteousness etc,,,indeed,we ourselkves mek choices in life,which sometimes werent the right ones...this process InI call ``learning``...Him always ready to give one His Wisdom,His Love and all further goodness there is... Remeber,for the ones that think that JAH has something bads for us or so,THE GOODNESS OF JAH ENDURETH FOREYVA Thx and Praises Selassie I JAH RasTafari The Lion guides and Itects InI,evrytime,inna each an evry way OneLove&Inity

Messenger: mdjonas Sent: 1/15/2004 3:09:52 PM

Jah-rastafari, I and I. Consider what this means. This is the truth and the truth is our foundation. Jah is One. Creation forward itinually from the Most High. I and I rastafari forward from Jah Most High. Jah live in I and I and I and I live in Jah Most High. What I just wrote is the only foundation we can base our knowledge on. That is our faith and identity. I don't claim to know everything, and there is many holes if I was to try and explain everything fully, because I do not have full knowledge. We are all men, so we know something about the nature of a man. A man has the ability to perceive physical reality. A man has a mind to choose his actions, and a man has a will that guides him. I know that man creates. And I know that Jah is the only creator. So it follow that Jah and man is one. In the same way man has knowledge of reality, and I know that all knowledge belongs only to Jah. That imply again, on another level, that man and Jah is one. Also man have a will, and all will belongs to Jah. So again man and Jah is one. So we can see that man and Jah is one in terms of man will, his mind and the things he creates with his hands. Now, about choices and guidance. It is obvious that we are free to choose according to our will. That again show the oneness because Jah is free to choose, and so we are free since we are a part of him. The key is that we are not fully aware of what we are doing, what we are causing with our actions. That means we cannot trust our minds to guide us, because our minds are not completely knowledgable so we cannot lean on them. But Jah live in our will also. And our will is the same as Jah will. I can talk around this forever, but words are not really useful. Only Jah can shine the light so that the words will become powerful. By themselves the words are empty. But in terms of Babylon. I see that Babylon teach me that good and evil are in a war. They say that the devil is fighting against Jah, and Jah is fighting the devil. They say that I am corrupt and all men are corrupt and have evil in them. They say that the devil has power over men to influence men, and men can choose between following Jah guidance and the devil misguidance. All of us have heard these teachings. But I know that nothing can be fighting against Jah, because all there is in creation is Jah. He is the only power in creation. I know that Jah create I, and Jah cannot create anything evil or wicked or corrupt, because he doesn't know how to do that. I will is Jah. I knowledge is Jah. I physical is Jah. I powers of creation within creation is Jah. I man is Jah. I and I man is Jah. I man is not seeking to become one with Jah, but I am seeking to realize my oneness with him. I am fighting not against powers or evil forces, but against ignorance of the truth of my identity. That is not really a fight, like it means when we say a struggle or war. There is no conflict...... only that I am journeying forward toward the full knowledge of myself, that I am Jah. So about the conversation going on, everyone listening should see that I am not arguing against free will, or destiny. We are free to choose, and we have a destiny. What we choose is Jah. Our destiny is Jah. Do the brethren not know that I and I are Jah Most High? Everything follow from that.... there is no need for big quoting of scripture or difficult logics. Anyway I man itinue to chant down all illusion with words of truth and knowledge of truth and will of truth. That is I and I path. I capability, I responsibility, I ability, I personality. Fire keep on blazing. Jah rastafari, Nyah Binghi I, Immanuel I. One more thing. Do not try to put I words on a cross. Listen to the meaning and not just the words. Know the truth from within and do not seek to analyze the words with intellect.

Messenger: Ark I Sent: 1/15/2004 3:59:24 PM

Greetings, Putting your words on a cross isn't how I would put it, I would say that your words were tried, as silver is tried before the fire. It is a good thing to try words Jonas. Look at what has come out of it. I now have more Iverstanding of what the I is saying. Certain things the I said didn't make sense to I so I asked questions, and now the I has explained more about what the I is saying and so I now have a greater Iverstanding of your words. I see all of Jah Creation as One with Jah with a little exception. The only thing that I see as separate from Jah, is our mind, unless we choose to be One with Jah in completeness. I sight that Jah gave this choice to I and I to make a creation that does his will by choice, even though they have the option to choose not to. This is a greater thing to create, a being that doesn't only deal with Jah ways because they don't know how to do anything else, but a creation that deals with Jah ways, because they want and choose to. Jah can create anything, there is not even one limit or bound to what Jah can create. So Jah can create something that is One, or something that is separate, or something that has a choice to be One or separate. I and I can't put any rules on Jah because Jah is the ruler. I and I ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. So I and I can choose to do something uplifting, or something that destroys. And Jah is watching His Creation, to see how people choose to live. And when judgement day comes, he will keep those that are One. Jah live, Ark I RasTafarI Haile Selassie I

Messenger: ijah Sent: 1/15/2004 4:28:05 PM

Greetings one and all Still me haaffe say some things, Bro MDJonas ,ye wrote inna ye last post:``But I know that nothing can be fighting against Jah, because all there is in creation is Jah. He is the only power in creation. I know that Jah create I, and Jah cannot create anything evil or wicked or corrupt, because he doesn't know how to do that. I will is Jah. I knowledge is Jah. I physical is Jah. I powers of creation within creation is Jah. I man is Jah. I and I man is Jah.`` I cannot agree to the statement ,that one s will is also that what JAH wants.....NAH,NAH....I agree that evrything is created by JAH only,and that nothing can fight against JAH...But the wickedness that is in this world,what ye also talkin about,is not by the will of JAH . That is by the choice of man,which has this free ,own will....In saying that Jah is in evryone,and that evryones will is also JAH His will,it nah treu,cause that would imply that Hitler hiis deeds were also by the will of JAH..Should i mention more examples Jah created evrything,and many a times we brethren also saying that He rules us all.....In saying such,we must not forget that this ``all`` only refers to those kinda people that are truly commited unto JAH,those that are very heavy disiplined ,concerning themselves and their deeds and actions and so...So,in saying this,i imply also that there are but a minority of people here pon Earth,that truly deserve to be guided in all them thoughts,desire and wants doings in this time...that is reality...those people can say that their will is indeed JAH His will We could say we live 2 lifes inna the same moment,we live an ``earthly``life,and also a ``spiritual``life Generaly,ones will is,in i opinion,a reaction of both the flesh and ones ability to think free,INNA this ``earthly`` life,which offers a lot of ``nice lookin`` and ``atractives`` and more of them deceitfull means...You know...ye see some,next ye wannna have it..Glitter an Gold ILLUSIONS ,i would say. And i know that this ``spiritual`` life is guided and led by JAH only,but to live it out fully,{in your will,wants,desires}here pon Earth,seems still to be a task not easily to be completed fully...But only a few out of us all succeed in that.Those who do succeed,them will and desires and wants and so.gonna be but only seeking JAH,HIS KNOWLEDGE,HIS WISDOM.etc etc....those people are indeed being ruled by HIM, also in practisizeing,and thatmeans not living inna Babylon,inna fenced house sittin in front of the computer,...just to give a good example,it a due So, i would say that the majority of all people,who live a life ``combinated`` of the ``2 lifes`` as described,are partly led by JAH His will and partly by their own will. And the few ones that are only being led by JAH His will,in all deeds ,actions,thoughts and whatsoever they do,them have reached the Spiritual Heights at the Highest Regions So,to get back to the point... i think that all of us,who join this forum here at Ark i`s,belong to the ``combinated`` way of life,nonetheless still keep on strifeing after becoming that High..... Me nah offend anyone or so,me talkin generaly,but in i sight it a the truth,and i just felt iman had to mek this statement....If ye all know what i mean!!! HAIL H.I.M.HAILE SELASSIE I RASTAFARI OneLove&Inity ijah

Messenger: mdjonas Sent: 1/15/2004 6:14:05 PM

I man give ises unto the most high itinually. It is a great blessing to reason with many in this congregation, because I do see my own culture is shared with many here. Bro Ark I even receive the vision to read between the lines about what is going on in my mind and he remind me that reasoning is always good..... i give thanks to the most High and Bless the I Ark I for that reminder. I am trying to express a firm knowledge in my heart that the Father place there. It is only the words and the communication that I and I is seeking. It seems that Ijah, and Ark I seem to be making the same claim, which is that we are different from Jah in our minds. The reasoning they are making here is that man has the choice to follow Jah guidance or not, so that mean that Jah is not always one with our minds, but that he can become one with our minds if we choose correctly to follow his guidance, which is our choice to choose. A man chooses, and that choice is a creation in itself, because that choice is something that happen... the man choose, so something happen. So that is a creation. A man cannot choose and without it being Jah who is guiding him to make that choice, because only Jah is the creator. I really don't see that a man can choose different to the guidance of Jah. A man choosing is doing something, so the power to do something got to come only from Jah. Now, again, I am not saying anything against free will, but I am saying that free will is actually oneness with Jah. A man choose freely, and that is Jah choosing with him, together in oneness with him, and that is the only explanation that make sense about how a man can choose, because only Jah have the power to let him choose. So Hitler and others: What can I say? I don't have the full explanation so I could show the congregation how it was a good thing that Hitler do. But if you listen to his speeches you will see something there that is good, because he really loved the Aryan people, and he really loved Germany. Yes he was confused, we all know that. But no other than Jah inspire in him the power to choose the things that he did choose. And it is Jah power that kill all the people that Hitler choices killed. I man don't question Jah choices, because those things He created were for the best. I don't have the full overstanding of HOW it was for the best, but I do know it was so, simply because it happen. It happen, mean it was created, mean that the creator do it. That mean Jah do it, and that mean it is a good thing, even if I can't understand how it is good. Even if it look bad when I think about it, that can only be illusion making it look so, and me making false assumptions and not thinking clearly. If I had the full knowledge of everything I would see how it is good those things that Jah did that seem so terrible to us. Don't I and I see terrible things every day and ask the Father how he is allowing these things to happen? Even if you don't voice those thoughts you must be having them, because it is a natural reaction. Is all that make me didn't accept that Jah even exist as a youth. But now I know that it is just that I am judging wrongly and THAT is what make creation look unfair sometimes. Believe me, many times men do imagine in their minds false things. And they imagine that it is good for something to happen when in fact that would not be a good thing. That is illusion. So in that sense I would say that the mind of a man can be contrary to Jah. But I do also know surely as I am sitting here, that when a man imagine illusion like that, those things can never manifest in creation. If a man imagine falsely that he needs to kill someone and Jah don't want that person dead at that time, then the man cannot kill that person. And anything a man choose to do, it can only succeed if that is Jah guidance. So I see now where we are getting confused in the communication. Now I can say it more clearly. Give thanks. A choice that a man make, that he actually put into action successfully, that can only come from Jah. That is oneness with Jah. But a choice that a man make that never manifest, that never existed in creation. It is illusion. So Hitler choice to take over the world (because that was his aim) that was a false choice and that was not oneness with Jah. But his choice to kill so many Jews, that was Jah guidance. Don't ask me how, but it was Jah. No man can create evil with his hands. I know there is no evil in creation.

Messenger: ijah Sent: 1/15/2004 6:28:17 PM

Iman do not agree SELASSIE I RASTAFARI

Messenger: mdjonas Sent: 1/15/2004 6:28:20 PM

A couple things to add. Always a man knows what he is doing. That is just law, because man is a being with knowledge and free will. He cannot do something without knowing that he is doing it. And a man is guided always by love. Everything a man actually does it is from love. Knowledge and love come together in everything that a man does. That mean it must be Jah, who alone has knowledge and love. Also that is power, because love and knowledge together is power. Please note that this is what is meant by the title Haile Selassie, power of the trinity. I man and I and I are the power of the trinity. That is the power of love and knowledge. Illusion is not real. It is false. It is not Jah. Jah is reality. And man is reality. Man is not illusion. Life is not illusion. Life is power, knowledge and love. Those things are reality. Anything that is illusion is not life, and it is not Jah, and it is not I. I man am real. I and I are real. How can a real mind follow illusion? It is a contradiction in terms. How can a real man do evil? Contradiction again. How can I go against Jah guidance? How can I go against Jah will? I refuse any allegations against me and against rastafari. I and I are perfect! I and I are Jah and are without any fault. I man cannot live without Jah. I life cannot be against Jah. Jah IS who I am. It is impossible for me to stray. Now I know very well as all in the congregation do that man can feel fear and guiltiness. That is illusion. Only power and love and knowledge is reality. However it may seem. So right now I put faith in Jah to show me to realize who I am, that I am perfect, so that I would not listen to the teachings floating around in my head saying that I am guilty and evil and that I go against Jah guidance. Nyah Binghi is everything to me, because I see that is how Jah will show rastafari who I and I really are. The fire is the glory of I and I, because it reveal the truth of I and I identity as sons of Jah, pure and perfect. Anything else must burn out. So keep it blazing brethren! Let we reason it out. The knowledge is inside us just waiting to be freed fully. Truth!!

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