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White ras

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Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 10/25/2013 7:45:11 AM

this thread isn't to debate the authenticity of white ras...... I see at least two other threads in this forum for that so please save the argument for over there and not here I just have some questions that have always struck me - what is the view on repatriation? specifically repatriation to Africa? - how does one feel about the teachings and philosophies of Marcus Garvey? - what is the belief on the holy trinity as the black woman and child? - nyabingi = death to all white oppressors. does this seem racist? - are you aware of bob marleys racial views on black progress? was he a racist? - so many reggae artist (which is assume is where many got the original idea of rasta from??) from sizzla to burning spear speak about the glorious black black and black empowerment etc race clearly is a important issue . what's your view on this? - lastly are you aware of post-colonialism? And the current and present day European strangle hold on African resources trade and culture? answers to all or even one or two would be appreciated. as I said this wasn't to start any war, I just wana know. it seems suspect to I personally

Messenger: Raybob Sent: 10/25/2013 2:22:46 PM

- what is the view on repatriation? specifically repatriation to Africa? My view is to go as Jah leads. Personally, in school, I never paid attention to geography, history, so wasn't until recent years I became aware of all the history of Africa, especially Ethiopia. InI now have strong desire to visit Ethiopia, just to walk on the ground, but airfare is over 2600USD r/t. Someday. If I were black, Jah might be pushing me more in that direction. - how does one feel about the teachings and philosophies of Marcus Garvey? Unfortunately, I know nothing but will study. From all I know, I would assume everything he said was 'Jah breathed', as I also feel of everything I've heard from Bob Marley. One cannot be Jah, in that there is only one Jah, but one can be one with Jah, as He was one with Jah. Still man, still capable of sin, but impossible to sin living by the spirit of Jah. Since declaring myself a Rasta, my recent studies have been Kebra Negast, Hallie Selassie I, Ethiopian culture, will get to Garvey, but still new to Rasta. - what is the belief on the holy trinity as the black woman and child? I don't know about it. I know I was taught a Holy Trinity, could never find it in my bible, of Father, Son, and Ghost, but I don't follow that. I also don't doubt for a minute that Mary, mother of Jesus, was black, or at least very much darker than the famous paintings. - nyabingi = death to all white oppressors. does this seem racist? Racist? Not really. I feel it too, to all oppressors. Yes, most are white, but that doesn't mean death to all whiteys. To me, all are born spiritually dead. Only by dying to self, and living in Jah spirit can one come to life and reign with the King. Yes, death to all white oppressors! - are you aware of bob marleys racial views on black progress? was he a racist? Racist? No way. Bob understood the babylon system, which is totally white led. That did not make him a racist any more than I. - so many reggae artist (which is assume is where many got the original idea of rasta from??) from sizzla to burning spear speak about the glorious black black and black empowerment etc race clearly is a important issue . what's your view on this? They need to let me jam with them. ;) 35 years ago, I was young full time musician in SF, last apartment was in ghetto, black bar across street. Went in there to jam with guitar, got many stares being the only white near that place. Nobody was friendly in the least. I got to sit in with jazz/blues band. After that, all smiles from everyone I saw, with pats on back. Music heals the soul and anything wrong with it. As for "original idea of rasta", It was Marley's songs that opened my eyes to what I had been learning all along. I was music man (worship leader) in churches, until I challenged pastor with questions he couldn't anseer. 7 years ago, I typed up letter of resignation, handed to pastor and all elders. They couldn't argue and wished me luck, as I left. I was well respected moderator of end time forums tearing apart their non-sense of future kingdom (not present) with scriptures, knowing the Kingdom was here and now. When I found Marley songs, I knew full well what he sang of, just didn't know the words for it. I knew of babylon from bible studies, but didn't know 'Rasta' until I heard, then realized it, from all my past bible study. - lastly are you aware of post-colonialism? And the current and present day European strangle hold on African resources trade and culture? Unfortunately, somewhat aware, but I assumed that has been going for many many years now, like at least 400. I know the babylon system is absolutely ruthless in their ways. Since moving from KY to CA, I've learned so much real history of western states of the slaughter of native Americans, not that long ago. Yes, babylon is a white thing, but some of us whiteys are now slippin out of babylon, at least me that I know of personally. I live in babylon, just not 'of' it. It will all just melt and burn soon anyway. Jah bless H.I.M.

Messenger: Nazarite_I Sent: 10/25/2013 10:12:50 PM

- what is the view on repatriation? specifically repatriation to Africa? Repatriation is for the Black people of the African diaspora to go home. No one can repatriate to somewhere they are not from, that is just travel. From I angle African Repatriation along with fair and just Reparations represents at least the beginning of the healing of the wrongs of slavery and colonialism committed by I ancestors and is a step forwards on the road to lasting peace, equality, security and prosperity in the world. That being said, if say a man of European decent in America or Australia does want to 'Repatriate' I suggest Europe as the destination. I and I could use some Ras to back I and I up over here, and the indiginous people of those lands never did stop wanting their land and culture back after being pushed to the brink of extinction. - how does one feel about the teachings and philosophies of Marcus Garvey? I love Marcus Garvey like He was I own uncle. Probably even more, because I uncle and I aren't so close. I did reply to the I on another topic about this before I read this one, but I'll repeat quickly that Marcus Garvey did teach I heaps about self respect and dignity alongside knowledge of self and the value of knowing your roots. The correctness of many of His teachings and philosophies have been proved to I along the road of life. One of I only qualms is His attitude towards Haile Selassie I during the Italian invasion of Ethiopia, which I thought was rash, even rude in the extreme and probably caused Marcus Garvey's decline in popularity in his later life as Ethiopia's cause became the rallying cry for African people all over the world. The other was His attitude to Leonard Howell and the early pioneers of RastafarI who declared Haile Selassie I to be Jah. What I know about Garvey's reaction to them, which was very negative and based very much on their use of meditation and ganja, leads I to think that perhaps Marcus allowed his head to swell slightly from his position. That being said, the greatest honour I and I can do a Man is to learn from both their greatness and their mistakes in the knowledge that in their shoes, I and I would have done no different. - what is the belief on the holy trinity as the black woman and child? As far as I see, that is the original holy trinity of creation when the man is included. Black man and wombman were the first on the earth from which all humanity sprung, that is fact, and the whole Iception of the trinity is born from the creational power of two people to make three and traces its roots back to ancient civilisations and mystery schools in Africa and Ethiopia specifically. The catholic church has very successfully wiped the man out of the equation and whitewashed plenty of pictures, but even when I visited Poland recently and saw many old and new devotional images of Mary and Christ, there were many Black ones among the white. Outside a Benedictine monastery in England I visited following Haile Selassie I's footsteps there was once a Black Madonna holding a Black Christ as well before it was cut down and stolen, and everyone these days knows even the pope prays to a black mary. - nyabingi = death to all white oppressors. does this seem racist? No that is not racist, and I'll chant it until it happens. It is not racist to chant death on someone who is oppressing you as terribly as Europeans have abused Africans, especially when the aspect of race and colour was picked upon by them and not you. Racism creates division among mankind and the most racist I see are white oppressors at the top of a global system of white supremacy. With that dead and gone I think racism would be much less of an issue. - are you aware of bob marleys racial views on black progress? was he a racist? Yes I am aware, and no he was no racist, just a man seeking progress, justice and redemption for his people, and that I admire. If anything it is this aspect of Bob Marley I would prefer to see brought to the fore more than the 'One love' aspect. Though it is important still, too many people today take it as a joke thing, forgetting that love is meaningless without truth, equality and justice. - so many reggae artist (which is assume is where many got the original idea of rasta from??) from sizzla to burning spear speak about the glorious black black and black empowerment etc race clearly is a important issue . what's your view on this? I might have listened to plenty of reggae music, but it is Haile Selassie I anyone truly comes to RastafarI through, and He is no reggae artist. Still, artists like Sizzla and Burning Spear are doing a good works when they sing about Black peoples empowerment, because it is only from a position of knowledge of self and Ifidence in their own power that Black people will win any equality in the world. Because of the systems of white supremacy in place from colonial days, it does have to be won in this time, but the victory of good over evil is assured. - lastly are you aware of post-colonialism? And the current and present day European strangle hold on African resources trade and culture? Very aware. Colonialism and the economic and cultural systems that made it what it was were never dismantled, they just changed names and tactics. The same institutions that gave birth to and were born from colonialism are still running all over the world. The most iconic example that I have seen of this is the murals in the underpass at Elephant and Castle station in London, marking the location where the doctrine of scientific racism and European supremacy was decided upon and adopted by a gathering of prominent European scientists. The mural depicts black people in subservient and incompetent positions with the white figures as saviors. This mural has been expensively restored by the City of London (the bankers for much of the slave trade money) for many years, while just round the corner are ghettoes where black people from all over the world are effectively segregated in poor quality run-down housing estates by economic and cultural disenfranchisement. I've put plenty of time and energy into piecing together what I can about how this system works and what its effects and reach in the world are and what I found and lived as I separated Iself from it shocked I deeply enough to now be in the position where nothing shocks I anymore and many here call and treat I as a radical and extremest simply because I speak out on it and the truth of how brutal and degrading it is. I am painfully aware that much, if not all of Europe and America's so-called wealth is plundered from Africa and elsewhere to this day, right down to the parts of the computer I am typing this on. I am under no illusions that their tactics have got any more humane either, because time and time again, world events prove that this system and those who control it are still willing to commit to the worst bloodshed, genocide and slaughter to get what they want to feed their economies, the veil has just got thinner as time has proceeded, despite their best efforts. In light of this, what I seek and work for is a shift in European culture at the grassroots level away from the parasitic and destructive relationship we maintain with the world towards one that is self-sustainable and self-reliant, utilizing our own natural wealth in the land, trading fairly with the world at large and giving freely what reparations can be offered to right the wrongs of the past that will only come forward to destruction in the future if not redressed. If I may ask the I a question in return; what does the I find suspect about European RastafarI? Blessed love

Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 10/26/2013 6:18:36 AM

Give thanks for the response. Anyone who sights Mr Garvey, and recognises rastafari as a response to the post colonial and post shattle slavery of Africans I can deal with. In regard to your question: the suspicion comes with those from what I have seen who apparently do not know this fact about the origin of Rastafari, have yet to hear the philosophies of Marcus etc. and as said in a earlier post, there is no doubt in my mind that Rastafari was (and is/should be) a celebration of ones original lost African traditions and culture: from the garments to the bush healing to the language to the view of spirituality, it's all there. Rastafari teaches to celebrate ones own culture. For the most part I see European dreadlocks talking, dressing, living ...under the same influence of African culture. It would make more sense if after reasoning about Rastafari, one went into ones own culture ideas and ideology. Nevertheless, nobody can tell others what to do, but it seems suspect to I personally to claim the celebration of another culture as your own. Especially knowing the power it has to uplift the black nation. The worry also is that if it is a pure mixed group, would the movement have the same effect on black kids ad youths with no sense of identity and direction if this is no longer their thing. And I know many conscious white people who agree with Rastafari principles / teachings / way of life on many different levels; but don't call themselves under the umbrella term of Rastafari and grow locks and drape in red gold and green because they overs that's representation of a nation. A lost nation of people who are in desperate need of nationhood and identity

Messenger: Nazarite_I Sent: 10/26/2013 1:15:15 PM

I agree with the I that it is suspect, or at very least misguided to live totally under the influence of another people's culture. Certainly anyone who is seeking RastafarI or any knowledge of Haile Selassie I, wherever they are from, will learn at least something about African culture, since that is the root of the movement and of all human life and civilisation. I see no issue in the branches of the tree of humanity knowing about it's roots in Africa. If anything it is lack of that knowledge or more lack of respect for it that has allowed for such deprivation to take over culturally in Europe and spread over the world. Although Haile Selassie I spoke undeniably to and for Africa, the original cornerstone of creation, He spoke to and traveled the world also, expounding on universal principles of truth and justice, to the level where I can't deny to anyone that He is the Most High Manifest in flesh and Earths rightful ruler and live I life to learn, uphold and bring forward His mission. And I see and agree with the I's point about Identity, even see examples of it here in England where certain Black youths don't really sight RastafarI because they see Rasta as watered down or whitewashed by a false 'One Love' philosophy that neglects the continuing reality of racism and injustice and the need to respond. There is a point to be made there, and it is a result of both an influx of ignorant white people into the culture and the ignorance of many Black people who sell out the culture. I won't even deny that in the past I have lived that first example, but education and experience cure ignorance, and those are the solutions. I am not here to teach Black people about their culture, they must do that themselves and there is nothing I can teach them about themselves anyway, but I can very well teach I own people about themselves. I solution to this challenge is to respond to the racism and injustice from an angle often unfamiliar and shocking to many and live RastafarI Livity as a European man while reminding whosoever wants to hear and many who don't that really RastafarI can't be watered down or whitewashed, because it will always be at its Root about true equal rights and justice for African people. This I speak out on from the angle of a man of conscience, seeing that injustice anywhere threatens justice everywhere and that complicity in it is what maintains it. When I speak to both black and white youths on this, they see the truth in it and at least overstand why I am who I am. This two sided approach is important I feel if I and I are going to break down Willie Lynchism, because the aversion and distrust between Black and Black and Black and White are strongly linked and were knowingly and cunningly planted. It is not a natural thing, but a result of the worst brutality and inhumanity inflicted by man on man that has caused black people to hate themselves just as much as the average white people hate themselves. Sadly what passes for culture in the mainstream of Europe and America these days that is also held up to black people the world over is out of touch with its own roots in the extreme. It is habitually destructive and parasitic to the whole of creation and as the I pointed out in a next thread on here, plenty even forget the principle of man and woman balance that brings new life, as if they were never born from a womb. And while I am all for going into, discovering and living I own culture, I refuse to equate that with walking into a pub, drinking beer, watching football and chatting some slack, racist or off-the-TV bollocks with some wastemen. When I look to the ancient past of I own people and touch I roots, I see no contradiction in I growing locks as an Englishman. When the Romans invaded this island they recorded that many of the people, priests and warriors had 'hair like snakes', and there have always been ancient traditions on these Islands of hermits, holy men and bards (musicians/poets) growing long matted locks, from the ancient days up to the Roman imposed Christianity and beyond. Those traditions are what I am seeking to revive, because it has almost been stamped out. There is even an ancient tradition of ganja cultivation here, since hemp has been a crop of these islands since ancient times, before the Romans, used to make soap, rope, clothes and plenty of other things besides its sacramental and medicinal uses. I don't deny I have drawn inspiration from the African stories and people I have heard, seen and studied and I fly Haile Selassie I's Red, Gold and Green over the bloody union jack with its higher body count than a swastika any day, but at the root I am who I am, and I am from this land where I am now. I eat good seasonal food, foraging some and trying to source it as locally and organically as I can on I budget, with plans to grow more and teach people about the value of their own natural foods in maintaining health physically and culturally. I make the effort to link and build with people reviving and maintaining the old self-sufficient ways of doing things, whether its spiritually or something like woodland management and crafts. I walk, Iditate and burn fire in the woods of I own land and remember I ancestors who did the same before I when the Islands were covered in trees as far as the eye could see. One day when I have a good Empress from I own vine and fig tree, I'll teach I children about their roots and the traditions that I have been rebuilding to pass on to them. I'll tell them stories about Buidica, the Icenei Queen who fought the Romans and burned down London, right up to Sylvia Pankhurst, who stood beside Haile Selassie I for Ethiopia's cause in the face of fascist aggression and is buried in Addis Ababa in the Ethiopian Patriots cemetery. Along with that, of course I will teach them about Haile Selassie I, Marcus Garvey and many other positive examples among African people, because colour and nationality are no barrier to inspiration or indeed cooperation between peoples. Only babylon could come up with something so divisive and heartless as that barrier. Blessed love

Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 10/26/2013 2:15:29 PM

agree or disagree agree to disagree. Nazarite, I wa say I man recognise and respect the fact as a man you nah get emotional and ting about them subject deh. Put my idea across and unuh come with your reasoning. A so it should stay still. Too much repeating the same shit and nobody actually looking into the detail of something when reasoning about this majority of the time. Man get label racist or man get told 'your not rasta' and dem ting when this topic come up. A LAVA. Anyway, that never happen in dis thread. give thanks hear.

Messenger: zion mountain Sent: 10/27/2013 1:52:32 AM

About John Marcus In response to Nazarite I views on Garvey. One elder did say Rasta is a conception i.e what one thinks,he went on to say a bird can fly over here to do Rasta work without itself knowing dat its carrying Rasta work. So as Marcus Garvey,him a do Rasta work unaware of it,him a just an instrument of Jah.Marcus had Haile Selassie I Irit in him,and only Jah chosen children can Identify or recognize Jah in Marcus and not the man himself. As to the culture.Haile Selassie is a universal God and everyone can recognise HIM in their own roots and culture.For example,the Indian Hindus can recognize H.I.M in their own culture,prophets and scriptures.If one is Chinese,follow Rasta in chinese culture etc,dats Garvey teachings. As for we black people,we shall look to God through the spectacles of Ithiopia. Ithiopia for the Ithiopians Asia for the Asians Europe for the Europeans America for the Americans Each man under him own fig tree

Messenger: Matthew Sent: 10/27/2013 1:09:30 PM

So is there more than one God ?

Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/4/2013 4:38:47 AM

Yes

Messenger: GARVEYS AFRICA Sent: 11/4/2013 12:08:39 PM

From creation man see God through there own eyes. It's the same essence but different manifestations through the interpretation of man. Indians see god through their eyes. The ancient Egyptians saw god through theirs. Buddhists see god in themselves personally. Marcus told the black people of the diaspora in the United NEGRO Improvement Association (UNIA) to see god through the eyes of Ethiopia. It coming like he meant that to the whole world? No need to sugar coat the truth, we know who Marcus Mosiah was talking to... It's his doctrine To I Rasta will always be an extension of the UNIA philosophy...

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