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INITY TRADITION

1 - 1011 - 19
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Messenger: gideon Sent: 12/1/2004 7:45:52 AM
Reply

"If there were words that would define the struggle, not scientificaly, but in a literal sence to give people a visualzation about what the fight is against, I still say its good over evil."

That is the idea I was getting at, that there is no scientific thing like that. But in the sense of personal life it is definitely good over evil.
There is a tradition, whatever you want to call it, that is the good way of life - do good tradition. And the other way will fade away. Good over evil.
The point I was making is that everyone is seeking that higher path, naturally. I want to focus on this point because it is the foundation of the power of King Selassie's government - the kingdom of God. We have to have faith that everyone is good in their hearts, and with this faith in mind we will find the way to reach out to people and guide them in a positive direction.
We need to fight against the thinking that men are evil in their hearts. In their actions, yes, in their thinking, yes, but not in their hearts. When we remember that everyone has a good heart then we will find the courage to lead them to a better understanding. But if we imagine that they are evil in their hearts then there will be no cause to talk to them, because obviously you can't talk to something evil about good.
The kingdom of God is wordsound and power. We spread the knowledge by words of love - truths and rights. The foundation of this process of teaching and leading people with words is that we must have faith that people are able to hear and acknowledge the words we speak. Another way of putting it is that we must have faith that people are good in their hearts.
To flip it the other way, the power of the pope to confuse and divide our people is based in the allegation that men are evil in their hearts. To conquer this power we have to spread the word of truth saying that all men are God's children and in their heart of hearts are seeking him and love him. That way, division cannot enter into our thinking because our thinking is grounded in the firm conviction that in our hearts all mankind are brothers and sons of God.
All that remains for us is to manifest the oneness of love by teaching the words of truth and rights. I know that all of us already do that. In fact it is because of people who came before us and taught that we even know what we know - especially Jesus Christ and Selassie.
So what I am saying is that we need to spread the knowledge and faith that all men are good at heart. I believe that this faith is the foundation - the basic element of the tradition of love. And you know you have to build a church from the foundation come up. So we need to stress the founding principles as we teach about the rest. That way the building comes up strong on a solid foundation.


Messenger: the rock Sent: 12/1/2004 10:33:38 AM
Reply

Anything that you build has to be on a strong foundation. If the people love god in their heart (mind) then that would be their starting foundation. In the bible, it talks about haters of the lord. I take this as people that know that there is a JAH and still, do not want to work in gods plan or just plain hate the lord. And that would mean they know the lord, in their minds, and still go their own way. Like the Cain and able or even their parents Adam and eve. They new there is a god (creator) and still they went their own way. Cain killed able, Adam bit the fruit. So if I was to build something up although I must have unity that unity comes with truth. If a person prays to god, asks god to help them stay in the light and still they step out the light (meaning they go their own way) then the truth which is the foundation in this project is that the person is not trying to be what I would call Good or of god, but really the person wants to go there on way. Some people like to take the teaching of the great books and then make their own name for what they have learned, change up and say they are the ones that are god, like the people that build the Tower of Baal, Nimrod felt that he was not matched and that his foundation was stronger then gods. Therefore, the Tower of Baal was destroyed, and the people were made to do god work any way, which in this case was to spread around the world.
So I know that JAH has a way of leading the people know matter what they want to do.
Unity needs to be truth with out truth there is no foundation. If I was to build a building (lets just say a chruch) I would need to measure the ground and make sure that it is not only level, but also that it is packed hard enough not to give under pressure, then a inspector (The inspector is like the elder) comes in and checks the measurement and only after all that do you lay the foundation

If the unity is to be had and a foundation is to be laid by the people for what ever they are trying to do. In this case we are trying to bring to the people together, by people getting knowledge of self that starts their foundation, thatís the measuring part, then people have to know what they want and if that is to be walking in the light then people need to walk in the footsteps that god has left us to know were to go, still improving on them, that part would be pouring the concrete. After the concrete is poured, the people have to keep building step by step until we reach the top. And that would be the highest region. If the person does not start with truth (about himself or herself about what they want) then their foundation will not stand the test of time (JAH).

In addition, for myself I would help anyone that I can. I would not tell them Iím better then them, if they really want help they will find it in themselves and people will see the light and be drawn to it by what is attraction of energy that are alike.


onelove


Messenger: Ark I Sent: 12/4/2004 2:54:04 AM
Reply

Gideon,

You could have just said what the I said in the most recent post of this reasoning, and the truth of what the I is trying to say would have been seen. The hot and cold, up and down philosophical discussions were not necessary for the message, and even took away from the message. The I message is clear in the reasoning the I just made.

But about the first discussions.
-------------------------
Hot and cold, up and down, good and evil, right and wrong. When we are comparing things this language is useful. But these concepts cannot be used to describe anything absolute.
-------------------------

Hot and cold, up and down, good and evil, right and wrong are very useful and important thoughts when I and I are Living in this Earth. It doesn't make a difference that they don't describe anything absolute. If these things are no more and all we have is absolute, then thoughts of these concepts are vanity. But since we need these concepts for our survival, they are not vanity, but are of great importance. A burning coal may be cold compared to the Sun, but seeing it as cold, or neither hot or cold would get yourself burned. What is important to I and I is that it is hot compared to I and I, so if we touch it, we will get burned. Also up and down are of great importance to I and I. If we say snow isn't coming down relative to the speck of earth that the water formed around, then we have no need for shelter because the snow isn't coming down. If we think like this, then we will be eventually smothered and encased by the snow. It doesn't serve any purpose to explain away these things, all because of some imaginary concept of absolute. Where can you go that it would be useful to do away with hot and cold or up and down.

Right and wrong, good and evil are also very useful descriptions to keep I and I society in Health and Prosperity, and to keep I and I Earth, air, water and all that is thereon in Health and Prosperity. I have no desire to do away with guidelines that show I and I what will destroy ourselves and what will bring Life to I and I.

And when you spoke about absolute, when we are speaking about Hot and Cold, neither of these two terms describe the absolute, as you said in the quote above. So absolute would not be called Hot and would not be called Cold. So why would the absolute of Good and Evil be called Good as you said, based on the same logic you put forward, the absolute is neither Good nor Evil.

I don't know of any person on this earth that has only evil in them, but there are some who have a lot of evil in them. Some only have good intentions for their own self, and if they deal with others they only deal with evil. And there are some that extend some goodness to their immediate family, but to nobody else. And there are others all throught the range between evil and Good. And there are some who have mostly good thoughts and actions towards others and theirself, with a few evil thoughts or actions towards others. And some deal only with righteousness, although this One is the rarest.

For the majority of people, I would agree that they have mostly good intentions, but the majority also has varying degrees of evil intentions. And there may be a rare few that do evil to another and truly don't realize that they are doing evil. But the majority know, at least for most things that they do, whether they dealt with a good action or thought, or evil action or thought. There conscience freely tells them this. The majority weigh out how much evil they are willing to do, compared to their perceived benefit or gain they will recieve from the action. And different people have different standards of how much hurt, destruction or death they are willing to perform.

It is naive to imagine that people have only the intention to do good and that when they do evil, they are doing what they think is best and good. Speak to some people who are willing to be truthful about there wickedness, and you will see that many don't care what evil they bring to others as long as they get what they wanted, and others feel a little guilty about it but feel that the others hurt is still worth their gain. And if you are truthful with yourself, you will know where you stand in the spectrum. I know where I stand in the spectrum, and I know where I am walking to, and I also know that I must blaze Fire and judge myself based on my thoughts and actions to give I strength to move towards Jah until I come out if this spectrum, and be truly in the image of Jah and One with Jah.

Jah created this spectrum for I and I, and created I and I with a conscience to know what is Good and what is evil, and created I and I with the ability to choose whether we walk towards Jah ways or away from Jah ways. Jah created everything for a reason and this is the type of Creation we are. I don't need to question why Jah created I and I this way, and I will not limit or define Jah to say that since Jah is Good and Jah is Love, then every man or woman that Jah creates are doing good things and expressing their love. Why must this be so, the scripture shows how small our thoughts are compared to the greatness of Jah, so how can you use man's speck of sand logic to define what cage Jah must logically fit in. When I speak of man's speck of sand logic, I am speaking of all men and woman on this Earth, and comparing it to a speck of sand is even a large exaggeration because Jah is so great that we can't even imagine the comparison between our thoughts and Jah.

I and I should trod towards what Jah has shown us. Why do you think the definitions of right and wrong exist? They are here because Jah gave them to I and I to instruct us in the example that Jah has set for I and I to Live. I and I must bring our minds towards Living the Way of Life that we call Good. Just because a person deals with evil, it doesn't mean that we don't reason with them and awaken them to Iverstand the greatness of trodding towards Jah way. I can accept the reasoning that people may not Iverstand the greatness and joy of Living in Jah way. But I can't acccept the reasoning that you spoke of about the man stranded on the island who rapes the girl is doing the best that he knows, or is expressing his love. The man would know by his conscience that it is not good and that it is not love. But he accepts this wickedness to get what he lusts for.

Some who deal with wickedness want to trod towards righteousness, but some don't. Some enjoy what they receive as a result of their wickedness and they don't care if it brings destruction to others, so they have no desire to change.

Like I reasoned before, let the filthy be filthy still. This does not apply to the majority of people, but it does apply to some. We must realize this because our words will be spoken in vanity if we try to convince certain people about the greatness of Jah ways. Time that could have been spent on someOne who may deal with wickedness, but desire to change their ways, or at least have the potential to open their eyes to this. I and I just need to realize who is who, people will always reveal themself in time.


Ark I
RasTafarI
Haile Selassie I


Messenger: gideon Sent: 12/4/2004 9:08:43 AM
Reply

I appreciate your response. Heartically we are on the same page, becasue we are reasoning about love and truth. It is the mental conception that is different. You said:
And when you spoke about absolute, when we are speaking about Hot and Cold, neither of these two terms describe the absolute, as you said in the quote above. So absolute would not be called Hot and would not be called Cold. So why would the absolute of Good and Evil be called Good as you said, based on the same logic you put forward, the absolute is neither Good nor Evil.

The thing is that it is not logic that makes me say that the absolute of good and evil is good, it is faith. I have faith in one creator whose nature is good and whose spirit is love. That is how I know that the absolute quality of everything is Good. Logic cannot get you to see it, but by faith.....
Logic is a tool that we can use to test things and I used logic to show that there is no absolute of all those things. It is true what you said that it was unnecessary, but I had to go that roundabout path because I didn't have the knowledge at the time. It is only when Rock said it is not a scientific thing that I discovered that very simple way of saying what I was getting at. So now that I have the knowledge of that explanation I use the same style and I repeated that it is not something scientific. I learned something.

We use the words good and evil as our culture of expressing the nature of guidance, and that is good. But we have been taught to make a jump and apply good and evil to absolute concepts, that is why we are taught about Satan and God, Good and Evil, Devil and Angel, Good and Bad spirits.
The point that I am making is that we need to confine our use of the words good and evil to that cultural expression you talked about. On the absolute level it is wrong to speak of evil, but it is right to talk about Good. When we jump from the relative level to the absolute level the meaning of the word Good takes on an absolute meaning, but the word evil disappears completely because it does not exist on the absolute level. I know by faith, not by logic.
And now that I am writing it, I realize that I could have stated it so simply at the start, but I didn't have the knowledge at the time. So it was necessary to go through all this roundabout explanations. Both you and Rock have helped me to narrow it down to something I can state as simply as I just did, because you showed me certain words. The thing is that I had a concept in my mind, a vision, but I was unable to express it in words. So we had to go round and round for a while.



Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 12/4/2004 11:01:27 AM
Reply


Greetings InI,

I agree with focusing first on the brethren/sistren that show a desire to learn about JAH before trying to guide the brethren/sistren that dont show that desire. This way I feel we will get more brethren and sistren back to the TRUTH and the more the better. Then InI should redirect the focus of our work on the InI whose mind and heart is more deeply entrapped by Babylon. As I believe Gideon said, at the root of InI there always is goodness and this is what InI have to focus our work of Love on.

Blessings to JAH Children,

Bergy


Messenger: gideon Sent: 12/4/2004 2:34:23 PM
Reply

You cannot focus first on those who show a desire to know Jah because ALL show a desire. What you can do is focus on those who YOU see to be showing a desire. That is the natural way. You lead who you are inspired to lead and within the mystic everything will be performed.
Just don't tell me that SOME people don't want to hear about Jah, or don't have Jah in them. That is the problem I have with what Ark and the whole world is saying. It is a hatred teaching designed to divide and conquer the people so that we are unable to lead the people to Jah. That is why as warriors of truth the first thing we need to do is destroy that false teaching. Then we can move forward and teach. Just know it to be true and state clearly that it is so, and that way you destroy the lie. It's that simple.



Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 12/4/2004 6:06:02 PM
Reply

Gideon,

I find you take what I say to much word by word. I meant exactly what you just said, that we should focus first on who we see showing desire and then step to the ones that do not show this open desire. All of us yes I agree all of us do have the desire but I was reasoning that we should focus on those that actually let the desire come to the surface by their actions or words. Seen? maybe I should have been more clear since everyone reads word in their own way and I did not see that you could interpret my words in the way you have. Essentially we both see it the same way. I will try to be more precise next time. Well I find as Arc sees it that some people do not show the desire to find the TRUTH but that it just because they are not ready yet to look for the TRUTH, I believe most will look for it eventually, some may take all the way until their days in their earthly body are about to be over but I do believe everyone eventually will look for it. We all have it inside us. Some just need more guidance or support than others.

Again, we all have JAH in us we are all JAH creations so there cant be an argument there. Just because some dont know they have JAH inside consciously does not mean they dont have JAH inside, but these brethren or sistren may be to entrapped into the system that they never make the time to nourish that light of JAH inside. Seen?

Rastafari!

Bergy

I will be out of town among others visiting JA and planning to meet up to reason with one of the great ONE LOVE Rastas on the island. It is great to know that there are so many conscious people all over the world.


Messenger: Ark I Sent: 12/5/2004 12:43:05 AM
Reply

The prophesy will not change, as it is written, so shall it be done. A great number of people will always refuse Jah and their time will end, this can be seen by prophesy and this can be seen from experience and observation.

Ark I
RasTafarI
Haile Selassie I


Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 12/5/2004 8:10:09 AM
Reply


Yes Arc I, but I firmly believe anyone can be brought back to the right path. We are all JAH creation. JAH is good, JAH has his truth in all of us. Some cases may seem helpless but none are, just easier and harder. This is my thinking...

Respect!

Bergy


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