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Messenger: still looking Sent: 9/4/2007 4:15:18 PM

ten, i can only say that i hope your words are read and dwelled on by those reading... religions (i won't just say christianity) have been the root of many evils in the world ------ i see the struggles that africa finds herself in as a direct result of religions.

on yahoo news today there was an article about how christians in nigeria were trying to eliminate/destroy (whatever one wishes to call it) the ancestoral traditions of that country.

i know some would like to put the blame for many of the injustices at the feet of white people, but if one was to really look at it closely, yes the people were white, but in many cases they were following the rules written in their bible.

any how --much thanks for your teachings on this very important subject


Messenger: Diego B. Sent: 9/4/2007 4:56:48 PM

Greetings Sis Ten,

many misunderstandings, yes.I think we should stop speaking about women condition, for now. Let's concetrate about the real topic (but also about that, many things have been misunderstood, about the veil too).
A lot of time you asked me to clarify what for me is "natural". I will remind you the Speech on Spirituality of HIM, when He says that Spirituality is the very original path, just as shown by the Almighty, from the root of Creation. This is naturality: the livity which comes from the Root. And HIM teaches us the Bible (no one can deny), and the Bible (Whose interpretation is not just as you can read it) says that Adam and Eve where first created. The blessings He gave us, was to procreate and fill the earth (of course, praying HIM night and day). This is Naturality. I can't imagine fro my own how He did everything, and I jsut trust in what Haile Selassie said, Which is what the Book says. Nothing is wrong in the Bible, the fact is: do we read It as we should, so to understand in the Heavenly way? This is what He teaches us.
The "test" i mentioned could be explained in this way: homosexuality is not natural, and if practiced it is disrespect towards the Word of God, because it is not just sex, but it is the keeping on doing what one wants to do, because of his naughts. As well as when we are among those who are sinful, we may be temptated (not by God), but we can rexist, and get stronger and holier. The natural state of gaymen is the same. In fact, being homosexual is not a sin, but just a state of mind and body. Just, one has to rexist, knowing what Jah says about.
And many gaymen could be able to have the strenght of the holy monks, if they would. It is a prove in this sense. Prove our sins, is prove our goodness. Because prove our goodness means stand and wait to see if we will do the right thing or the wrong. So , also this is the same. Then, please, I know you where jocking while writing about the entering of one man in one another.... I know you know what the point was.
The mental disorder I've mentioned, was to make you an example that not everyone is born like all do. Just this.
I said of course, judgment is reserved ONLY for Jah.

Messenger: Diego B. Sent: 9/4/2007 5:10:44 PM


1)How can I say acceptable one thing that IS? It is, and that's enough.
It stands for itself.
2) The reasons I was talking about were not the male orgnization, but, at the contrary, the abuse of children. And I' m sure, we both agree about this.
3) Sexes are not the same, and that is logical. It is like saying that the left is the right. And that is to say that, everyone has his own duty, due to his nature. As well as men have their own duties in the community, the women have their own duties too, and no one , but them, can do that. Men+Wombman=life , and life is not just "birth" but the "social living", the Church Which is alive. Everything here on earth has two sense, right and left, man and woman, Alpha and Omega.
And all is One in Jah. No slave no free man, nor woman nor man in Christ; but still everyone has his duty, as said above.

For a RastafarI, it is unpossible to admitt homosexuality as true way of living: Man-Jah ------ Wombman-Assembly of Saints. One flesh!

Blessed love

Messenger: Ten Sent: 9/4/2007 6:13:45 PM

Blessed Love Diego B
Aya yes there are many misunderstandings but there are also overstandings – depending of course on where you are standing and what your positioning is. Now your definition of natural stems from His Majesty’s word on Spirituality. He defines this as:
“Spirituality is not theology or ideology. It is simply a way of life, pure and original as was given by the Most High. Spirituality is a network linking us to the Most High, the universe and each other. As the essence of our existence it embodies our culture, true identity, nationhood and destiny. A people without a nation they can really call their own is a people without a soul.”
For I, I see women’s friendships as embodying a spirituality as Audre Lorde and Alice Walker write quite extensively on Black women’s sexuality as rooted in a spiritual consciousness. One that is linked to their cosmic roles as keepers of the universe, as female gods, in Shona cosmology women are spirit mediums and they are rainmakers. In Igbo culture there are female deities charged with special responsibilities. My point is that because Black femininity is articulated as a spiritualist consciousness then sexuality also embodies the same thing. For Black African-American women who are lesbians Walker and Lorde argue that these women are taking back their earthly power from the male systems of oppression that have denied them this power. By expressing a womanish sexuality they express a love of themselves, of the moon, of the Creator and a love of other women – In Search of My Mother’s Gardens puts this quite nicely. Same arguments can be made of African women who in resistance to the invasive bodily insepections, countless rapes and beatings by colonial oppressors, by loving each other women are taking back their power. They are taking back their femininity from those Black and White male oppressors. It also allows them to rediscover their bodies and re-own themselves in a divine sense too as a womban is Mother Earth. Audre Lorde writes a lot on erotic desire as a spiritual foundation for Black women. I know its displeasing to some Ites I use His Majesty’s reasonings to justify an act they feel is abominable, but this goes beyond the act of being lesbian – its so much deeper and goes to the core of who one is. There is political, spiritual and cultural agency in being homosexual and so I won’t see it as an abhorrent practice – that’s just at face value but once you go further its less about sex and more a discourse about human subjectivity/identities.
Now Aya you said
“ HIM teaches us the Bible (no one can deny), and the Bible (Whose interpretation is not just as you can read it) says that Adam and Eve where first created…. Nothing is wrong in the Bible, the fact is: do we read It as we should, so to understand in the Heavenly way?”
Ehm Aya I one of the first things you learn in Rastafari is how contradictory the Bible is. It has missing parts and has been handed down to us in that way. Its hard to just see the Bible as a solitary book without seeing the attached meanings to it. Interpretations of the book have a huge influence on how we as individuals read it so our views will always be influenced by what we are taught. I won’t say “nothing is wrong in the Bible” but I will say many things are inconsistent and incongruent so I have my questions but I’ve learnt that Jah’s Bible is not those hemp scriptures we cling to so sacredly. We’ve got to stop this the Bible says so mantra – we are people with individual minds with power of interpretation and discernment.
Jah’s Bible is Creation, its the everyday and in everything, Jah continues to reveal to I, and I Third Eye reads this Living Bible. In these scriptures of the everyday is how I learn to celebrate the differences and diversities as people. Knowing that some are gay, some are straight, some are childless, some have tribes of children and others die lonely pensioners or young geniuses. That’s life. Life is the bond between man, woman and child as many like you have uttered including myself, but life is many things as well. It’s as simple and as complex as a single breathe. Whether one loves a man-man, woman-man or woman-woman, its life still, that’s Jah gift to us. I’m saying a nuclear family bond as given in the example of the Trinity – man-woman-child is not the only celebration of life. As a woman I cherish that I can carry life within I, truly I do and I’d love to have a tribe of children someday, but that’s not all I am. I embody life in many ways.
I’ve explained how homosexuality can have its roots in spirituality as Jah defines it, but I still don’t get the test or how it operates if we are speaking of re-discovering spiritual self through erotic desire. And what if it’s a matter of survival as I asked before – what is sin then? Don’t we apply the philosophy of relativity and take each in its particularity. God is a just God, a loving God and an understanding God. When a situation arises He always provides a way out. Try burn fire on the Meru women or the Bemba of Cameroon or the next gay person you see and they will tell you how their God loved them enough to allow them to survive in this way. I might be naughty and suggest you should get to know a gay person, I mean really without the feelings of disgust or animosity, see them as a person before you just make generalised condemnations of all people of same-sex orientation. I suppose you’d also burn fire on prostitutes because the Bible says so. Or would you be okay with them because Mary Magdalene washed Yesus’ feet?

Messenger: still looking Sent: 9/4/2007 7:49:45 PM

ten - i wish i could have you come into my classroom to discuss this issue --much respect

Messenger: Ark I Sent: 9/4/2007 10:41:44 PM

Many people talk about genes that show a person is gay.

If they truly found genes that were linked to batty boys, what it is really linked to is men who are more feminine than other men. Just because a man is feminine doesn't mean they are gay. But when these feminine men grow other people tell them that they are gay and they believe that foolishness. Or others are not told directly but are treated differently and nobody came and told them that it was ok to be a feminine man and it doesn't mean that they are gay.

I just saw an episode of Dr. Phil the other day. He had men on the show who were heterosexual and married, but had many feminine ways and a feminine physical and facial structure. Dr. Phil criticized these men for their feminine ways, but I know that if some batty boys came on Dr. Phil's show, he would never criticize their feminine ways. This is part of the conditioning that guides these people into destruction.

When I was in high school, if a man was more feminine but not gay, people would say that it was just a matter of time and they would eventually fall out. And then there are men who are old and gray and are feminine but are not gay. If only more would see the truth and realize that being feminine may be part of their structure, but being gay is not.

Many people may not believe me, but one day when your scientists learn more about Creation, they will tell people the same thing.

Ark I
Haile Selassie I

Messenger: Ras KebreAB Sent: 9/5/2007 12:10:19 AM

Iyah, as the i said before, let the filthy be filthy still.

A man is born with a bit more femininity and that means he is supposed to put another mans organ into the hole that Jah gave him to remove waste material from his body ????? Is that how it goes?
And people actually need the Ible or any other holy book to tell them how wrong that is ?

What a thing when the human mind, probably the most complex and powerful thing in iration goes uncontrolled

Let people talk about all the justifications for being gay all they want as if that will make it right. Stranger still when people use love as a justification for homosexuality.

A few years ago a research paper was published called
A Meta-Analytic Examination of Assumed Properties of Child Sexual Abuse Using College Samples,"
this report actually claimed child sexual abuse could be harmless and beneficial to society and took its examples from ancient cultures like Greece and Japan and talks of all the different justifications for this disgusting practice
So ?
Let the filthy be filthy still
Ini know where Ini stand

Rastafari Is

Messenger: Ras KebreAB Sent: 9/5/2007 12:28:43 AM

if you really want to be disgusted , read on

Messenger: Ten Sent: 9/5/2007 9:31:24 AM

Still Looking give thanks for you words Aya, I hope your students, will have an open mind to these matters. As youth growing up in a metropolitan world where identities are never fixed and are so radically diverse, the only way to exist in such a world is to deal with these realities rather than shun them. We live in complex times and likewise we need to equip ourselves to be able to live; the first step is knowledge. Let the youths be empowered with knowledge so when they encounter difference in others or in themselves they know how to handle it.

Messenger: still looking Sent: 9/5/2007 9:37:36 AM

so true.....

fyi --- just found out a i have a student in my homeroom from zimbabwe---you should have seen here eyes bug out when she heard this marungu in america say mungwanani to her.(exuse my shona spelling)

a kid feeling comfortable--priceless


ps -- i would love a list of some of the books you have read on african culture

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Haile Selassie I