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Gideon

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Time Zone: EST (New York, Toronto)
Messenger: GreenEye Sent: 11/9/2004 9:52:04 AM
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Gideon,
I really ask myself what the I(really Idren?) did in past that he has to excuse.
We are all RESPONSIBLE for what we do, although we are free to do what we want. Not everything we do is the will of JAH!
But the will be a time when Jah will judge and damn the ones who acted against his creation.

blessings


Messenger: gideon Sent: 11/9/2004 12:17:04 PM
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Everyone who is listening:
I am going to start over from the beginning. As Ark says for me to support my point of view with reasonings I need to establish the basic principles and then use logic to build on these principles so that I can reach my conclusions.
In response to this process, I expect that anyone who doesn't like my conclusions will be able to explain why. Either they should refute one of my basic claims or they should find a mistake in my use of logic. If you cannot refute my basic claims and you cannot find a mistake in my logic then you have no rational basis for claiming that my conclusions are not correct.

So my basic principles for this reasoning are:
1. There is a being called Jah, who is the creator of everything. Everything that exists, existed or will exist and every event that takes place is the result of his will. He is the creator of everything and creation stems from him.
2. There are beings called men that are created by Jah. Men exist, as everything else in existence (creation) because of the will of Jah. Everything that men are and everything that they do are an expression of Jah's will, in the same way that all creation is an expression of Jah's will. Every thing that happens in creation, including men's actions, exist by the will of Jah, the creator.
3. Men are spirit and flesh. Spirit creatures (creations) manifest in the form of matter (flesh).

So now I am going to use these three facts and put together an argument. The conclusion I am trying to reach is that contrary to what we have heard and been taught, there is no wrong thing in creation. This statement that there is no wrong thing includes every action of every man, and every earthquake, tornado and every physical thing that occurs in creation. Here are the basic logical proofs that support this conclusion, based on the three "assumptions" above:
1. Every action of man is physically the manifestation of Jah's will, as Jah creates those actions through the medium of man.
2. The way how men do things is that man's spirit acts through the medium of man's flesh to create the will of that spirit.
3. Everything that man creates is actually created by Jah, manifest through man. This is practical oneness of will in the sense that what man tries to do and actually does is really the manifestation of Jah's will in creation.

I can go on and on, but basically I am just describing the same thing from different angles. The point is that whatever men do and whatever happens is Jah will. Which is what I've been saying all along.

So Ark and others. Do you have reasonings different to what I am saying? If so, please tear apart my reasonings in a rational and reasonable way so that people can see that what you're saying is correct and what I am saying is wrong. Start with the basic assumptions I made and refute them if you can. Then go on to my use of logic and show where it is wrong if you can. And if you want to quote from the bible or any other source while you're doing that go ahead.
But don't just say that you see it different and the bible says that it is different - that is not good enough. I have given clear arguments and shown the foundation principles I use, so if you want to refute my conclusions you have to say HOW you know that they are wrong, and not just that you don't see it that way, or that the bible says different.


Messenger: the rock Sent: 11/9/2004 1:15:11 PM
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I do not have a opinion on your argument, just wanted to say that i think that you write very well.

onelove


Messenger: Nefertiti Sent: 11/9/2004 4:45:14 PM
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Blessed Love Rasta FAR I Haile I Selassie I

just a quick reason on this post to the i's...........

Jah i-rated i in perfection....which includes freedom to chose i own movements, either in step witht the I-rator (INI) or alone, FREE WILL OR CHOICE........

INI not a puppet, nor clone nor freak accident of nature.

DOING GOOD as opposed to "EVIL" is a choice relative to the situation.

INI live timelessly on different levels of the ancients in this moment.

It seems this reasoning is heading to say that either JAH Is not perfect becuase of our prefections or that there is no such thing as EVIL......MAke ur own life live free and do what makes the I happy.

As for I, Doing the will of JAH is a choice made moment by moment. I choice that has been intrusted to I for the upliftment of INI. There is no judgement in that as each one convicts ones self. Site. U write ur won laws of movement becuz that is the free will that comes from the I-rator.

Ones, stop living in the world of enslavement either in body mind or soul. Free up your mind, make your self happy and give glory ot the Iraotr who made it possible for your FREE CHOICE.

INI rejoice in doing what is right even when I don't want to do certain things.---the DESIRE to DO RIGHT is what INI KNOW.

One love one aim one destiny


Messenger: Ark I Sent: 11/10/2004 1:33:31 AM
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Gideon,

I response to you in the Speak the truth... category applies here too.

Ark I
RasTafarI
Haile Selassie I


Messenger: +Ras Sun* Sent: 11/10/2004 8:34:51 AM
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Blessed Love Bredren InI will say this, I am not making an argument. But, what i will voice is my opinion. InI know that Jah created all and iverything. He gave iverysoul freewill to control there one destiny so the bad things that people do no matter what it will haunt you in time. So the I must analyze and take heed to iverything the I do. InI cannot forget the the devil is loose and some things out here are created through his influence on mankind, yet Jah did create the devil also. This is a hard road and we can not blame Jah for the good and bad only for the good because Jah is Love(which is hot like fya) the devil is as cold as ice so when trotting through babylon if the decision causes your heart to be as cld as ice that is not Jah speaking that is the devils influence. Jah only knows Love so Rastafari is love, and kindness, peacefulness, happiness. Blessed Love and Prosparity.

Holy Emmanuel I Selassie I Jah Rastafari Honorable MArcus Garvey I

Messenger+Ras Sun*

Ethiopian World Congress True Divine Church of Christ


Messenger: empress1 Sent: 11/10/2004 10:11:49 AM
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Greeting in the name of his Imperial Majesty,
Gideon I must respect your opinion but I hope you in turn will respect InI. I do understand what you are saying, completely.If the Creator created everything and everything the creator makes is good there is no bad. You're other more specific reasoning about "stealing" takes the same effect as the present. However InI beleive it is way more complex than you have made it seem. The Creator has Knowledge of everything Correct? He made man in his image correct? I'm sure you know that man has powers to a certain extent too right. So InI question to you Gideon is what is to stop man from manifesting evil himself? Since we were created in his likeness. I'll give you this scenorio. A man has a dog that he has trained and walks with him in the streets with him without a leash. The dog bites a poor unsuspecting person. Is this the masters folly.......Not really because the dog has been trained and knows right from wrong. What I am saying Gideon is that since the I already knows the path of rightoeusness stay on the path of rightousness. An Ible reference for you

Proverbs 11:5
"The rightousness of the blameless will direct his way aright, but the wicked shall fall by his own wichedness".

Now question bredren would you rather be led on a leash or continue thanking the creator for, as the I already said, I freewill. See Gideon a perfect world has choices but the too many of the intentional wrong choices lead to destruction.
God overDevil and H.I.M come first
MoreLove. MoreLife.
JahRastaFarI


Messenger: gideon Sent: 11/10/2004 3:29:00 PM
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Choice.
As I man forward within the perfect livity of Jah rastafari, Haile Selassie I, Jah powers of creation manifest through I and in oneness I create according to my divine pleasure. Jah pleasure, I pleasure, same thing...... Guidance.
Too bad for those who want to say I am a sinner, because as they judge me they have four fingers pointing back at them and they are judging themselves as sinners too. I know I am perfect and all men are perfect, so my judgment will come forward to me again and more and more I will know that I am perfect like all men.
I will always fight against these teachings that man are not perfect and creation is not perfect. But I am not fighting against those who repeat the teachings. I know that you are not really speaking clearly what is in your heart. In your heart you know that you are blameless and perfect, and so am I. In fact as I fight for the truth I know I am fighting for all of us and against no one, and in the same way I know that nothing you say is against me or what I teach. You are all part of the armygideon movement, whether you realize it or not.
I herald the day when all men will speak with clear words and a conscious mind knowing with certainty of faith that we are perfect just as our father is perfect.
So Ark and others, I don't believe the accusations you bring against our people, mankind. And furthermore, I don't believe that YOU believe what you are saying. Because I know that all men have unswerving faith in their hearts in Jah rastafari, Haile Selassie I perfect livity and oneness.
All I can say when I hear all the statements you are making is that you need to clean up your words. You are talking a mix up language that does not really reflect the truth that I know is in your hearts and minds. Anyone listening to you would hear you saying that there is evil in the world, but we all know it is not so. So all I can conclude is that your wordsound is mix up.
And that is nothing to be ashamed of. I myself try constantly to relearn how to express myself clearly and accurately. And I have made big progress and will continue to make progress, because there is no limit to speaking the truth of Jah-rastafari Haile Selassie I glory.
Forward, oneward and upward.



Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 11/13/2004 6:23:06 PM
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im no robot i hav free will................JASH has trust in me 2 find my way back 2 HIM 2 become 1 among all righteous that feel the truth and live the truth.

Blessed,

Bergy


Messenger: NineMile2004 Sent: 11/13/2004 6:27:36 PM
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Gideon InI nah judge.........we all hav 2 find the truth........everyone fi themselves........if what InI do u call judge then u do the same........InI know u r no hypocrit so InI know we nah judge. seen?

we all shall respect InI fi we shall nah judge JAH work. however, we shall all do good.........JAH nah mess wit evil..........he give us free will fi HIM shall nah enslave us with miracle....so HIM shall let us decide 2 find HIM again..........fi we all knew him before Babylon "erased" the truth........

Bless.

Bergy


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